Red / Blue / Green two player grid draft cube

Please stand by while I work out the bugs...

That title is incredibly boring, but pretty accurate. My wife and I are working on a two player cube for grid drafting. I suggested we cut a color before we began, and suggested black. She said we might as well cut white and play "the exciting colors."

Link: http://www.cubetutor.com/cubeblog/89946

The idea is to get to 162 cards. Currently 50 over. Also need to find another dragon or two so we can play around with Sarkhan's Triumph. I hope to get plenty of drafts in with this list, as I have several regular opponents, but often not enough to draft a normal cube.

It's past midnight, will flesh out the general design philosophy tomorrow.
 
Some updates while I have a moment.

Decided to up the count to 180. This will allow a 4 player draft (5 packs of 9) and looks to be a wild ride. The two Frontier Bivouacs will be removed before 1vs1 grid draft and given to each player. I am really liking how it looks, and it's sure to need lots of work, but that means lots of 1vs1 drafts with my wife. Report of draft later, if all goes well, and I actually finish my term paper.
 
I was able to get an actual draft and best-of-five set in with the new "head up" cube. It was a fun experience, and being able to trash talk an old friend during the grid draft was almost as fun as attacking, but I'm getting off track.

(Aside)

The cube was put together with cards sitting around the office. Most of them are things that have cycled out of my main cube in its peasant days, or cards given to me by friends who wanted them tried out in the cube. I don't expect it to always remain a budget cube, but I do like the idea of having as much fun as possible for no extra monetary investment.

(End aside)

My friend Henry dropped by the office this afternoon to help me test drive the cube. I gave him a rough idea of what I was hoping for the list, and I rambled about the kinds of themes I hoped were present as he glanced over the list. We shuffled up the cube, set out 16 packs of nine cards, and rolled 2d10 for pick order. I won and elected to pick first.

Pack one:



I took the top row after staring at Crater Hellion for 30 seconds. I like to try to force aggro decks in new environments. It's my opinion that format health is pretty closely related to how effective it is to be attacking with 2/2 dudes. Henry takes the bottom row pretty quickly. He said something to the effect of, "I'm either control or just bombs."

Pack two:


Henry got to select first in pack two. He took the left column pretty quickly and set Rolling Thunder next to the Hellion in his pile. After some thought, I took the middle column. I wanted to push aggro, and I wasn't about to pass up a cantrip, mana cheating, and what could be a great enchantment.

Pack three:



I take the left column to stay in red based aggro. Henry take the center column and sticks to bombs and more reactive cards.

Pack four:



Henry selects the left column. I take the right column to pick up the landfall dude and fixing.

Pack five:



I take the center row here, thinking that I am picking up ramp and a couple neat enchantments. None of these cards make it into my deck. Henry takes the top row.

Pack six:



Henry, like most of my old MtG friends, has an uncomfortable fondness for Flametongue Kavu and takes the top row. I scoop up the two 3cc dudes in the right column.

Pack seven:



I want to take Cathartic Reunion but am worried that I don't have removal and scoop up the bottom row. Henry takes the top row here, which I disagreed with. I think he needs the center column here as Mist Raven should be pretty solid against me.

Pack eight:



Henry grabs the blue cards on the bottom row and I take Harmonize and Treetop Village before he can change his mind. I think he needs to grab a column and keep one of the cards from me, maybe just straight up hate draft the top row.

Pack nine:



I grab the center row for the lands. Henry grabs the column with the signet.

Pack ten:



Henry takes the left column. There's not much here for me, so I grab the center column.

Pack eleven:



I want the Hooting Mandrills and decide on the top row over the left column. I thought the trap would be great, but I never had opportunity to use it, as I never had a meaningful artifact or enchantment get destroyed. The Ingot Chewer would have been a better card. Henry grabs the bottom row, though I don't know if he played any of them.

Pack twelve:



Henry takes the center column here, though I feel like the top row may have been better for him. I scoop up the left column for the two green tricks.

Pack thirteen:



I originally wanted the bottom row, but talked myself into the right column. I wanted the removal spell, and Goblin Rally was fantastic in the one game I drew it. Henry grabs the left column for the fatty, but I feel like the two blue spells in the center column are better for him.

Pack fourteen:



Henry takes the center column here, though again I disagree. I think he should grab Phantom Monster. I get the right column to add another 2cc dude to my team. I wonder aloud if the early pressure is enough or if I will just lose if we get to turn six.

Pack fifteen:



I like all the cards on the top row and take them. Henry grabs the center row for the lands, but I feel like getting the center column was better. Then again, I'm a sucker for Exclude.

Pack sixteen:



Henry uses his final pick to get the top row. I wish he would have given me the Overrun but that's just greedy. I grab the bottom row for the land. Neither of the other cards make my list, with Undying Rage being the last cut to get me to 40.

Henry ended up in Blue / Red midrange-control thing. He splashed green for Vengeful Rebirth. I played a fairly aggressive Red / Green list with lots of landfall triggers and a few combat tricks. The surprise MVP for me was Stormrider Rig. It was so much better than I thought, to the point that I am going to keep an eye on it.

We played a best 3-of-5 set. I won the die roll and elected to play in game one. Henry seems really pleased with his starting seven, but that smile fades when his turn two Simic Signet meets the business end of my turn three Reclamation Sage. He never gets back to board parity and a parade of creatures keeps him on the back foot until it's over. He is on the play in game two, and I mulligan to six but keep a good hand. I briefly considered keeping my seven land hand of Kird Ape, Ancient Ziggurat, and a couple 2cc dudes. I decided to have some respect for myself and do the sensible thing. Like I said, the six were good and we settled into a fun game. Henry and I traded the life lead for several turns. He wraths with Crater Hellion and I'm able to bounce back after passing the turn after it hits. He has to decide to pay echo with all of his lands against my empty board or let it go and untap. He decides to pay echo and pass. I had the Ground Assault to kill it. We play a few more turns until he has a couple prowess guys against my unleashed Splatter Thug and random 2/2 landfall guy wearing the Rig. Henry pauses to do some math and starts looking through his graveyard. He asks my life total and I tell him it's one more than nine. He says, "yeah, I can do nine." He ends up casting Vengeful Rebirth to get back a counterspell and uses the damage to kill my landfall guy. I untap, draw Ghor-Clan Rampager and swing. After he blocks, I show him the combat trick and we go to game three. Game three was back and forth until I resolved Retreat to Kazandu. The +1/+1 triggers are too much. Henry uses a few removal spells and blocks well, but the constant pumping of my otherwise small creatures is too much. My new friend Goblin Rally shows up with him at 8 life and he can't get enough blockers or draw a sweeper.

So the RG aggro deck won 3-0 against the URg control list, though I think Henry left a few cards sitting in the box instead of in his list. We talked about general impressions after the games and he thinks that I need to keep an eye on Retreat to Kazandu. I looked back over the list and there aren't a lot of ways to handle it. Should I look into something like Nevinyrral's Disk or Steel Hellkite to give decks ways to handle enchantments?

It was a fun experience, and I look forward to getting a few more drafts in this week to get more data. I'm not sure if going down the path of doubling up on the cards I want to define the format is correct. I have only broken singleton for Thrummingbird because I like the idea of proliferating +1/+1 counters. I jammed a small mill-esque package in, but I don't think there is enough there to force anything meaningful. Also wondering about Pulse of Murasa as life gain and graveyard interaction.

Super excited about this pile of cards. Hope to update again soon.
 
Quick update while I am thinking about it.

I took the cube to the our local Tuesday night board game meetup. I got three others excited enough to play, though one is a dear friend who is in town for Thanksgiving. We ran five packs of nine cards.

My friend Josh went 3-0 (6-2) with RUG control. He managed to go completely nuts with Sprout Swarm and Young Pyromancer against poor Alex. Josh won our match after three very tight games. He won his match with Norman off the backs of Vengeful Rebirth and Charmbreaker Devils. After the matches, Josh suggested that Sprout Swarm is too far above the power level to be fun. I tend to disagree, but then again, I had removal.

I went 2-1 (5-2) with URg control. My green splash was for Urban Evolution. The only pick I want back in the draft was p1p1 taking Flametongue Kavu over Rolling Thunder. Both of my wins were exercises in getting safely to 6 mana and then overwhelming them with value.

Norman went 1-2 (3-4) with UR "ramp." I use quotes because he tried to go all-in on Artisan of Kozilek off of Atarka Monument and Worn Powerstone. He also cast Nevinyrral's Disk every game. He seemed to have a good time, but kept complaining that his deck wasn't as good in play as it looked on paper.

Alex went 0-3 (0-6) with UG tempo. By tempo, I mean that he took both Thrummingbird early and went full Voltron on us. He often put together a huge creature off Retreat to Kazandu only to get blown out by removal. He also lost at least one game to Norman by throwing blockers in front of attacks instead of leveraging his life total and building his board.

All in all, a good night. I don't think Norman and Alex were as experienced as they let on, but it was a good time. Several people stopped by to kibitz the draft and games, so I'm hoping to run it again next week.

I want to go up to 2 copies of cards to push certain decks.

The short list includes Coiling Oracle...and I'm not sure what else. Maybe going to multiple bouncelands.
 
Sounds like some cool decks! How is urban evolution? Seems like a really good slower UG ramp value card if the format allows it. Sprout Swarn does look like a nuts card and I've heard others on this board complain about it. Might be worth the cut.
 
Sounds like some cool decks! How is urban evolution? Seems like a really good slower UG ramp value card if the format allows it. Sprout Swarn does look like a nuts card and I've heard others on this board complain about it. Might be worth the cut.


You have said it. It's a very solid UG ramp value card. It's slow for sure, but my deck wanted to stall until I could start dropping Crater Hellion and Hypersonic Dragon. Evolution refilled my hand after using removal and bounce early and made the bouncelands better.

I hate to cut Sprout Swarm but it may need it. Going to play with the list this weekend, try to define aggro a little, push UG tempo, and working in a few more dragons over random big dudes. I really want Draconic Roar, Sarkhan's Triumph, and Sarkhan's Rage to see more play.

Also really interested in Ugin's Construct.
 
Loving this! How did the grid draft decks feel compared to the 5x9, 4 player decks? I adv a bit concerned all of the 4p decks had blue. Maybe it's a non issue out the decks and games are fun. My significant other is looking to emulate your structure: 180 cards, 3 color. I'll let you know of our thoughts as it develops! General assumption: each color pair should have two main themes, with overlap into another color pair. Going to look a lot at leveraging restrictive mana costs too.
 
This will be rambling. It's 1:30 AM and I'm running off of coffee and key lime pie.

Huge updates to the cube this weekend. Played several grid drafts last weekend and even got in two different 4p drafts. Control decks were basically undefeated, despite my best efforts with the derpiest of beatdown. My vision of interesting packages and interactive games was ruined on the back of lots of blowouts. The removal was so much better than the attempts at early pressure that everyone abandoned trying to win a race and drafted all card advantage.

I'm pretty sure that I changed at least half of the total contents of the cube in typical knee-jerk reaction. Major revisions include:

Cut the landfall support. It only came together once and even then it was Stormrider Rig that ended games.
Cut the prowess support. Many feel-bads from drafters after only getting half of a deck.
Cut the +1/+1 cards. Decided to push blue into flyers and generally upgrade the counters theme into something else.
Toned down the power of UR flyers. Phantom Monster and Murder of Crows proved to be too good. Focusing on testing out 2 power flyers now.
Cut the "fight" removal for combat tricks and pump spells instead. It was comically outclassed by the red spells anyway.
Cut the vivid lands to try to help aggro, as those slots were invisible to the beatdown decks.
Got rid of the most oppressive removal (Serrated Arrows and Arc Lightning and Roast) in a bid to push aggro.
Took out the awaken package. It was more cute than interesting.
Trimmed the one drops with an eye towards making them count. Is 2 cmc aggro a thing?

Also doubled up on several cards to give stronger signals to drafters.

I managed to get in a grid draft versus my wife. She ended up in UR control and I was in UG ramp. She swept me 3-0 but all the games were close. Sleep was an absolute beating against me. I had Pelakka Wurm every game, but she found a way around or through him.

I am taking the cube to game night tomorrow and hope to report on a 4p draft. With all the changes, it feels like starting over but I'm happy with the first grid draft of version 2.0.

Future plans:

Continue to solicit feedback from drafters.
Work on defining archetypes by doubling up on more sign posts and possibly going to 3 of each anchor.
Figure out the anchors. To that end, I really need to write down what I want each color pair to do as a primary and secondary focus.

Thinking about Clan Defiance for RG, another Spellweaver Eternal for UR, Bounding Krasis for UG. Still on the lookout for interesting 2 cmc creatures for aggro.

Does anyone have a percentage guideline for removal?

Wife thought it was interesting that "green has the best card draw" in Harmonize and Urban Evolution.

Cards still needing to be exchanged:
Jeskai Sage
Curse of the Bloody Tome
Archaeomancer
Firebrand Archer
One of the green pump spells, maybe Sylvan Might
Wistful Selkie seems subpar

The Izzet sections looks lame, despite UR still destroying everyone. I wonder if I can push something like Burning Vengeance on Izzet or if goodstuff.dec would still be drafted.

TL;DR lots of changes and not sure it's fixed, but the games were fun.
 
Oh, I like this cube! I've got myself a graveyard BUG cube at 180, and will look through this thread thoroughly for ideas to stea- borrow!
 
Some recent results and a few thoughts:

Ran a grid draft versus my wife and lost 1-2 with UG midrange against RUG control. Long, grindy games lost to huge spells. I probably should have boarded into all my 3 cmc or less cards for game three and tried to get in before she set up. Ended up losing to Hypersonic Dragon off the top after we traded everything off.

I got in a 4p draft on Tuesday. All the decks were interesting in their own way. One player was loudly crowing about how busted his UR control was going to be, but he ended up getting rolled by UG Beasts and RG Fires. He then dropped. The UG deck lost a couple long games to me getting back spells with Charmbreaker Devils. I didn't get to play the Fires player as the venue closed and we had to leave. I feel like I would have won, based solely on my first picks:

pack one: Radiant Flames
pack two: Blasphemous Act
pack three: Nevinyrral's Disk
pack four: Rolling Thunder
pack five: Clan Defiance

Yeah...

Everyone seemed to really enjoy themselves. I asked the drafters to offer me some feedback, but most of it was "put in [broken card]." One of them - the UR control drafter - thought Capsize and Flametongue Kavu would be better than they were.

I managed a couple more grids this weekend, losing with RG aggro to RUG control and winning with RG aggro against UR control. I'm really enjoying how the games are playing out, but I am looking to tweak a few things.

1. Looking to tone down blue's card draw. Oona's Grace seems more where I want to be than any other card.
2. Wondering about blue's identity. I really enjoy the fliers, even wanted to add a second Paragon of Gathering Mists, but everyone else seems offput by the fliers package.
3. Considering moving Horned Kavu out. It's gone largely unpicked. Same for Skirsdag Cultist. Looks nice but not getting picked.

Izzet seems either slightly above the power band or just intuitively easy to put together. Every draft, whether 2p grid or 4p pass, always has someone sleep-walk into a decent UR board control list. I really want RG aggro to be interesting and pressure the format enough to keep the RUG bombs decks in check, but wonder if I'm neutering those lists by restricting the removal and card draw.

Looking into things like Manabarbs and Evacuation but not sure how format-defining that may be.
 
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