A stupid cube experiment

Jonas

Jonas

Ok, so I've got some thoughts buzzing around in my head and I need a place to throw them out and I might as well do it here, where someone might see the sheer stupidity and laugh at it, instead of just blinking incomprehensibly.

I decided to buy a box of Dominaria, since I'm something of a Vorthos/Timmy at heart, I guess. And it managed to evoke a lot of nostalgia, but not nearly enough! So, my latest project is a story based cube, which might end up at 720 or something crazily immense like that. But anyway. Here's the plan:
While it might be fun to have a deck that kinda tells a story, I want to incorporate that storytelling in the draft as well. So here is were things get really stupid. And a logistical nightmare.
The first pack drafted contains cards from Alpha to Ice Age block (including coldsnap), but excluding Arabian Nights and Homelands. The second pack contains cards from the entire Weatherlight Saga and some extras, taking us all the way from Mirage to Scourge, meaning the pool for the second pack has about a bajillion cards. The third pack is set in the modern-ish times of Magic, with the Time Spiral block and Dominaria.

Now, some sets might not too many cards worth considering (I'm looking at you, Prophecy) but most sets have cards that can fit into a wider story arc. The first pack will have a lot of Urza and Mishra, followed in the second pack by a lot of journeying with the Weatherlight, and the third pack has some flashbacks from TSP and history explained or expanded upon with Dominaria (Shame that the card is named the Antiquities War and not the brother's war).

Keep your eyes peeled at this spot, I might do something with this project, and I might just let the thread die.
 
Jonas

Jonas

Insight: I need to design this from the third pack and backwards, if I keep to this stupidity. Why? I need to know what mechanics are supported, so I can add clues to those in the first package. For example, artifact matters will most definitely be in the cube, b/c Urza and Mishra. A decent density of artifacts could probably signal that.
Another way is to turn the cube on its head, draft TSP PLC FUT DOM first and then have a lot of jank in the middle pack followed by the bomb spells in the last package, together with mixed random shit. Depending on what archetypes that can be supported, that might be a viable way of doing this. To make it scaleable for a variable number of players, a number of incentive cards might have to excluded from the draft and placed in the middle in something like a utility land draft. Since our group doesn't care at all about signals since we're all pretty shit at drafting, it might work. More stream of thought coming in another post.
 
Jonas

Jonas

You know what? I'll just gather all of my stupid cubes in this thread, that way I don't clog the main board, nice huh? So, this http://www.cubetutor.com/viewcube/96953 is my 93-94 cube. Allowed sets are Alpha, Beta, Unlimited, Antiquities, Arabian and The Dark.
I started out by looking at the decks to beat in the 93-94 meta, and then I have just thrown a lot of stuff against the wall, and there is a lot of crap in these expansions, I'm not even up to 360 yet, but I'll get there.
My plan for the drafting of this cube is that the restricted list has to be followed as you pick, so you are not allowed to draft two lotueses, for example.

Side note, how big a chance is there that someone has a 4 card combo on the draw with 40 card decks?
 
Jonas

Jonas

Man, old school white is like the worst colour ever. It's not that I didn't know this going in, but really? This bad? The card pool is 12 cards deep and 8 of them are enchant land, the rest are white knight, crusade, savannah lion and serra angel. Like 90 % of the white cards care about swamps. And circle of protection isn't really coming in, when I'm keeping most of the really stupid control decks out of the cube.
But hey, come on, and are great cards, right?
And the cards aren't outright horrible, they say banding on them, which I'm doing my best to keep out, because really, banding. But at this rate, I'll have to dip into fallen empire AND use a marker over banding on the white cards that are included.
 
Jonas

Jonas

inscho said:
Not running legends and fallen empires (both 1994) really hurts white's depth for sure.
Click to expand...
I actually run Legends, but I guess I forgot it while ranting. But FE at least adds some playable cards, thanks for the tips. Icatian javelineers is such an auto include! White weenie power.
 
Jonas

Jonas

Those might be a reasonable power level for control, but I'm steering away from Kismet or other effects that can make a prison deck, since that just saps all the fun out it. The thing with the old school control decks is that they are just so easy to put together if you give enough space, and then everyone is just playing the deck or the void or something. Kismet might be ok without too much supporting cast though.

My plan is this: First, I want to make a format where White Weenie, Erhnam Burn'em, Suicide Blue, Sligh and stuff like that is, while not forced, archetypes that can be aimed for during the draft. Then, through playtesting and goldfish drafts, I'd have to see how much control and prison effects are actually viable to add. Since I usually don't have 8 players, the Abyss might be a possibility then, I won't be too mad if it shows up every fourth draft or so.
But most decks will probably just end up as some sort of multicolour goodstuff piles anyway, but I think my players will enjoy it for a while.
 
inscho

inscho

Without stasis or winter orb, I don't think there's much danger in running kismet. I was thinking of it as a decent disruptive tool for weenie decks. Delay blocks and impede mana development by a turn.


EDIT: Neutering blue and red some has been important in my experience of retro cubes. Too much good removal, card advantage, and bombs.
 
inscho

inscho

Yeah, you just need to get about a dozen completed drafts under your belt to train it. You want the AI rating to be 100/100 or close.
 
Jonas

Jonas

Whelp, I had 360, then I added Fallen Empires, Ice Age and Alliances and now I have 556 cards. Maybe I should make it a 450cube.

Edit: There are actually a couple of weird-ass themes in it as well, but damn they're shitty.
 
Jonas

Jonas

Side project! Because I start projects and don't finish them and because my players want to play something high powered. I took "the most fun, exciting, powerful and balanced custom limited environment" and now I'm trying to make something playable out of it.
 
Jonas

Jonas

Jonas said:
Side project! Because I start projects and don't finish them and because my players want to play something high powered. I took "the most fun, exciting, powerful and balanced custom limited environment" and now I'm trying to make something playable out of it.
Click to expand...
I had a look in my first cube thread, when I had a MTGS-cube with power and stupid cards in a fine mix, and one of the first comments from CML was that if you're going to have a powered cube, actually have all of the most powerful cards. Which makes sense. There's not much meaning having a sol ring or a lotus and then use them to cast autumn willow, baron sengir or pirate ship. IMO it's pretty useless to cast stuff like the signets with them as well, signets seems like rocks for durdle decks, and there is no place for durdle decks in a vintage format, 1tk or go home.
So I'm thinking that the first pack you open should signal that this is powerful as all get out, these are the most powerful cards you can cast in this game, and you can cheat them out into play, you can get stupid amounts of mana, you can counter combos and you are not going to win every game unless you draft a pretty damn good deck, and manage to hate keycards for other players.

This is going to be pretty hard.

http://www.cubetutor.com/viewcube/106766
 
Onderzeeboot

Onderzeeboot

Ecstatic Orb
Jonas said:
Experimenting! What if I van make this format fun!? But it’s gonna take something other than untrained cubeai
Click to expand...
:D

To be fair, playing with power has its own allure. MTGO's Legacy Cube is popular for a reason! So... How are you going to differentiate your experiment from the Legacy Cube?
 
Jonas

Jonas

Onderzeeboot said:
:D

To be fair, playing with power has its own allure. MTGO's Legacy Cube is popular for a reason! So... How are you going to differentiate your experiment from the Legacy Cube?
Click to expand...
I don’t know yet. First thing I did was throw out cards that are strictly worse, like , now I’m working on taking out the archetypes that are just too worthless in a cube with this speed.
Red, for example.
Kidding, but only kinda. Zombies/black aggro will either have to go or is gonna get a disruption boost. I can probably add dark rituals without someone being allowed to hog all of them, since first turn mindtwist or hymn will be needed for the player to survive past the first turn. I’m not going singleton and using reprint cards, searing spear, incinerate, chain lightning etc will probably just be bolts, to make red more competitive.

Those were my thoughts for today, might come more tomorrow.
 
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