Card/Deck Dimir (UB) Steal & Sacrifice

Karn Cuberated

Karn Cuberated

Hello, comrades!
Has anyone had any experience with this archetype? I have some cards which might fit it well, but don't have a game-plan in my mind. I don't even know what it should be: midrange or control?
Iconic steal effects:

Sacrifice outlets:

Also, two questionable ones:
- looks like OK, but nobody seems to be discussing or playing it. Maybe, I'm missing sth?
- the one which caught my attention on the day it was revealed in spoilers. However, in this case relying on your opponents creatures might be a fragile plan, because she requires two creatures at once.
 
Rowan_CB

Rowan_CB

Hmm, my initial thought is this is an awkward pairing. Red/Black likes to steal and sacrifice because red’s steal effects are temporary. Blue’s steal effects are usually permanent, and, at a higher cmc, you’re almost always going to get better value just keeeping the creature than getting a sacrifice trigger.
 
TrainmasterGT

TrainmasterGT

I really see no reason to try this as a U/B archetype. The U steal effects cost too much for it to be worth sacrificing the creature after the fact.

Rowan_CB said:
Hmm, my initial thought is this is an awkward pairing. Red/Black likes to steal and sacrifice because red’s steal effects are temporary. Blue’s steal effects are usually permanent, and, at a higher cmc, you’re almost always going to get better value just keeeping the creature than getting a sacrifice trigger.
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Tzenmoroth said:
What Rowan said. Why sac your thing when I can just use it? I think this needs lower cost yoink effects that have drawbacks, which is more red than blue.
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As these two have previously echoed, R/B is a good place to use the "steal n' sac" archetype. Ravnic has used this archetype to great effect in their cube.
 
TrainmasterGT

TrainmasterGT

Karn Cuberated said:
And what about Vedalken Shackles? We can steal a creature, sacrifice it, then repeat this process
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I mean I guess, but thats really more of a synergy than the basis for an entire archetype.

I don't think this is a bad idea for a deck, it's just not the right color pair to be viable. Vedalken Shackles would allow for some of the Sacrifice-specific cards to be used in a U/B control deck, but it wouldn't necessarily be the primary function of the card.
 
Heymaker

Heymaker

Karn Cuberated said:
Ok, thank everyone so much!
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Karn, can I ask what your cube's power level is like or if you have a cubetutor link to your cube? I started typing up a post with some ideas, but figure it'd be pretty useless to you without some context. My ideas are probably more geared at lower power levels (e.g. less Dragonlord Silumgar, more Entrancing Melody)
 
Fulcrum

Fulcrum

Man I've been thinking about this archetype for like the past 4 years. I've never gone super deep into it, but the Dimir Aristocrats deck from Battle for Zendikar Standard and the Dimir Exploit Archetype from Dragons of Tarkir limited serve as inspirations.

Dimir Aristocrats Deck Tech

Dimir Exploit Primer

I feel like the best way to implement this would be to have the Steal and Sacrifice stuff be a component of a Dimir Aristocrats deck.

I like these cards as sacrifice outlets:



These cards suggest a midrange archetype where you're gaining incremental advantage over the course of a game rather than something more aggressive.

Time to plug some of my favorite cards even though the owl is probably not good enough. Blue token makers are probably very at home here. See Whirler Rogue + Nantuko Husk



Tzenmoroth made a very salient point and you'll need to give your players reasons to actually sacrifice the creatures rather than just use them. A good place to start might be to use stuff like Ray of Command, Domestication, or Vapor Snare rather than Control Magic or Sower of Temptation.

Reins of Power seems like it could lead to really backbreaking situations when paired with the right sacrifice outlets or proper sequencing.
 
Karn Cuberated

Karn Cuberated

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