Charming Prince is just so much clearer and more reasonant than Ennis that I legitimately see no reason to ever play Ennis over Prince unless you specifically need something that blinks and also cares about +1/+1 counters at the same time.vs
I do run a small counters theme, but it's small and not as useful as the Scry 2 in most decks...but it's still a free counter and it's not like you would run Charming Prince for the scry, right?
General Fight Club
- Thread starter Jason Waddell
- Start date
So, I really like Worn Powerstone in my cube but it has one issue: Since it enters tapped, it doesn't work with Goblin Welder, is a dead draw in storm and combo decks and, in general, is a bit limited in other niche scenarios. I was wondering if I could find a replacement that had a bit more synergy to it.
Any recommendations? Some cards I've been looking at are:
Basalth Monolith ought to be worse in control decks, but perhaps not.
Coalition Relic produces coloured mana, which makes it better than Worn Powerstone. It used to have a reputation as a goodstuff card but I'm not sure if it holds anymore.
Phial of Galadriel has an interesting ability and it seems like it could work well with Welder or big ramp decks that tend to run out of steam, but 3 mana is a lot to just tap for one.
Cursed Mirror used to be in my cube, but I cut it. I'm unsure if it could be decent now. I feel it would have worked if it copied creatures or artifacts, but just creatures is bad.
Any recommendations? Some cards I've been looking at are:
Basalth Monolith ought to be worse in control decks, but perhaps not.
Coalition Relic produces coloured mana, which makes it better than Worn Powerstone. It used to have a reputation as a goodstuff card but I'm not sure if it holds anymore.
Phial of Galadriel has an interesting ability and it seems like it could work well with Welder or big ramp decks that tend to run out of steam, but 3 mana is a lot to just tap for one.
Cursed Mirror used to be in my cube, but I cut it. I'm unsure if it could be decent now. I feel it would have worked if it copied creatures or artifacts, but just creatures is bad.
The fact that it costs 4 mana makes it too expensive for what I'm looking for. I need it to be 3 mana, sadly.
I already run it! It's way better, but it hasn't been oppresive after I revised my 6 drops.
Is net plus one mana. Otherwise basalt monolith or thran dynamo.
The mirror is fun, but since it already was cut I do not know whether it will be good enough now.
I see. Then I second Coalition Relic. Or... I don't know your Cube very much, but have you thought about
?It maybe does too many things, but a bit of card advantage (good in Control), ramps for instant and sorcery (good in Storm) and works with Welder. Also it is red, like Cursed Mirror which you were already considering.
Do you run multiples? Or just give it another name like llanowar/fyndhorn and run 2…
Dom Harvey
Contributor
One of my faves from the past year:
I'd go with Abbot personally, just not a fan of keyword counters in paper. Unfortunate that playing it on curve makes the impulse draw mostly useless, but it does give it greater utility if you play it later in the game. Just depends on what you'd want out of that slot.
I've played Abbot some time before, and impulse draw was so awkward for his place in mana curve. I also don't like keyword tokens in paper.
Counterpoint. I've played these and loved them in my low power cube. Scry is surprisingly handy:
Now I'll be trying this:
Revisiting Green meets artifacts.
The best way I've found for Green to bridge artifacts is by spamming the board with artifact tokens. I already run Tireless Tracker and would like another mono-Green option.
vs
I landed on these two as the easiest way to trigger and the ones with the highest ceiling. Provisioner is somewhat limited to Green since it's the best landfall color and quite similar to Tracker. Took has more play in other colors as they can all make various tokens, but Foods < Treasures.
Which would you go for?
The best way I've found for Green to bridge artifacts is by spamming the board with artifact tokens. I already run Tireless Tracker and would like another mono-Green option.
vs I landed on these two as the easiest way to trigger and the ones with the highest ceiling. Provisioner is somewhat limited to Green since it's the best landfall color and quite similar to Tracker. Took has more play in other colors as they can all make various tokens, but Foods < Treasures.
Which would you go for?
... two tireless trackers?
they're both not bad and could fill different roles, but I feel like not many decks are going to want tireless tracker AND/OR either of these two. If you have to, tireless provisioner, but I would go with option C. Or...
this guy looks a little bit less like tireless tracker at home, and encouraging attacking is good.
they're both not bad and could fill different roles, but I feel like not many decks are going to want tireless tracker AND/OR either of these two. If you have to, tireless provisioner, but I would go with option C. Or...
this guy looks a little bit less like tireless tracker at home, and encouraging attacking is good.
Yeah, for me the issue is that they are just second copies of Tireless Tracker but worse. Same cost, similar role and slots in the same spot. If you have to choose, the right answer is Tireless Provisioner but I would take anything else.
Interestingly, the card that has boosted green-based artifact decks the most for me is:
It being a land really makes you interested in green. There's also a tendence for Workshop decks to be Bazaar of Baghdad decks so that's two for one. AND, these are often Welder decks, which like Green's tutoring. If you really want to push this angle, I found this card to help.
Since it allows you to replay your Welders and Smokestacks, giving you the valuable redundancy the deck usually lacks. However, it's redundant with other green crucible effects so I cut it. Also, slow or not, it does give you infinite recursion which can feel pretty bad depending on the card.
You already run a card that ties green to artifacts, though and it's Samwise Gamgee. That thing produces a lot of tokens and valuable recursion.
Interestingly, the card that has boosted green-based artifact decks the most for me is:
It being a land really makes you interested in green. There's also a tendence for Workshop decks to be Bazaar of Baghdad decks so that's two for one. AND, these are often Welder decks, which like Green's tutoring. If you really want to push this angle, I found this card to help.
Since it allows you to replay your Welders and Smokestacks, giving you the valuable redundancy the deck usually lacks. However, it's redundant with other green crucible effects so I cut it. Also, slow or not, it does give you infinite recursion which can feel pretty bad depending on the card.
You already run a card that ties green to artifacts, though and it's Samwise Gamgee. That thing produces a lot of tokens and valuable recursion.
Can’t argue with that. My thought was I have essentially two Welders by running Engineer also. This gives me enough redundancy to have a Red artifact package.
In the same vein, having another powerful artifact token producer in Green gives me redundancy. This means cards like Cranial Plating, Nettlecyst, Arcbound Ravager, KCI, Tezzeret, Cruel Captain and others now see unique appeal in Green thanks to the amount of fodder the color provides. If one duplicate slot can unlock a whole collection of artifact payoffs, I think it’s a good use of a slot.
Workshop is a cool card for sure. Since lands is another unique strength of Green’s artifacts that reference lands are in a good spot.
Sorry to double post, but I've had a thought. What if this was the Green artifact producer I was looking for
Every creature now comes with an artifact. It's a tough balancing act to break the symmetry, but it feels like it has potential in Green to be better than in other colors.
Thoughts? Experiences?
Every creature now comes with an artifact. It's a tough balancing act to break the symmetry, but it feels like it has potential in Green to be better than in other colors.
Thoughts? Experiences?
I love it. I played it for many years, but thanks to its reputation from EDH, it got treated as a combo card rather than a value card, and people would draft it with the expectation they could go infinite with it and then would be disappointed. Technically, I think I did have Nim Deathmantle and Ashnod's Altar in Cube when it was around, but I never saw that particular combo.Sorry to double post, but I've had a thought. What if this was the Green artifact producer I was looking for
Every creature now comes with an artifact. It's a tough balancing act to break the symmetry, but it feels like it has potential in Green to be better than in other colors.
Thoughts? Experiences?
My biggest issue now is that it often helps the non-token decks more than the token decks. The token decks have a lot of creatures that are, well, tokens, and so it doesn't do as much for you as it does for your opponents in many cases. My big move towards supporting Stridehangar Automaton last year would have reasonably been a good case for it, and I considered it, but the symmetry issue came up whenever I looked at the decklists that would want it most vs. least.
Still, I do love the card, but between the poor signaling and the symmetry issue, it's a rough one.
If I see a genesis chamber in a pack, I'm probably looking for ways to combo with it than thinking "Oh man I should draft a lot of creatures so my 2 drop that doesn't immediately impact the board generates more value than it gives up!"
Don't get me wrong, it's cool as hell, but I don't think it does what you want.
Don't get me wrong, it's cool as hell, but I don't think it does what you want.
Yeah, you would need it squadroned with something like
for me to be like "hrrmmmm... so it's a creature deck" and not on the lookout for springleaf drum and intruder alarm
But that's a white weenie artifact deck and not a green deck
for me to be like "hrrmmmm... so it's a creature deck" and not on the lookout for springleaf drum and intruder alarm
But that's a white weenie artifact deck and not a green deck
That's a blind side of mine, I didn't really have any combos in mind with it, though I imagine it can grease the wheels of many. In my cube, I think it enhances Enduring Renewal and nothing else.
That's a good observation and honestly, I wasn't thinking of this as a tokens card, more of an artifact fodder card (or Arcbound Ravager, Cranial Plating and such). Now every creature deck has a bridge into artifacts, dramatically reducing the barrier of entry into a deck that is often about critical mass.
Stridehangar is a good example of a card that this buffs and breaks the symmetry. Though in an artifact heavy cube, you risk giving your opponents artifacts too which they might use better than you!
I guess I was thinking that Green naturally has more creatures than other colors (in my cube at least) + cheap mana dorks + recursion making it a good home organically. I can see it backfiring though!
I mean I could easily see a KCI deck making great use of Genesis Chamber. Or a Chthonian Nightmare deck using the fodder. Earthcraft is another engine that could elevate Chamber and so on. I appreciate your perspective as I tend to get carried away with high ceilings.Yeah, you would need it squadroned with something like
for me to be like "hrrmmmm... so it's a creature deck" and not on the lookout for springleaf drum and intruder alarm
But that's a white weenie artifact deck and not a green deck
Funny how I added Academy Ruins for that exact reason, but forgot about Workshop. I think you are rightnterestingly, the card that has boosted green-based artifact decks the most for me is:
It being a land really makes you interested in green.
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