Definitely a valid point. I'm reluctant to cut TT as it is such a great 1st pickable pivot card that specifically supports a lot of my green archetypes: Lands matter, Artifacts matter, Berserkers, and Stax. I find that it's a great segue-way for my drafters. It follows the traditional cube draft logic of staying flexible on the front end, but unlike a Flametongue Kavu, guides you to some of the more atypical strategies and nuances in my cube.
General Ixlan Spoiler
- Thread starter Chris Taylor
- Start date
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
Oh man, I really want to reinclude it now, even though I cut it for pretty much the exact reason sigh mentioned. I got feedback that green was lacking first pickable cards as well, so... maybe it is time to bring back TT!
Tracker may very well work for a variety of archetypal situations, I just think it occludes too much of what other green 3-drops are trying to do, in general. Why pick up the Yavimaya Elder when I can have this generically much better self-contained engine? So archetype support sure, but in such generically good fashion you can collapse the usefulness, to a degree, of other cards in Green.
Aside, I think Ripjaw Raptor takes the creature-based -draw-engine slot very cleanly, and at a CMC I'm more comfortable having it at.
Aside, I think Ripjaw Raptor takes the creature-based -draw-engine slot very cleanly, and at a CMC I'm more comfortable having it at.
A good question. Generally speaking, bitterblossom isn't as generically good in my format as one might think. It's basically un-runnable against agro decks in my format because they are more attrition based, for instance. And it relies partially on being able to maintain a board advantage, else it becomes a bad chump blocker a turn.
It's still very strong, and could surely see taking it out one day for some other effect.
It's still very strong, and could surely see taking it out one day for some other effect.
The stats bump is actually the main reason I want to bring it in. I'm lacking in aggressive bodies in that slot...everything is very midrange. It's more to do with not wanting to cut any of my other 3s to make room for it:
It'd probably need to be either Excavator or Courser. I'm probably overly supporting Lands Matter in green as it is. Manglehorn may seem like a weak link, but it scratches a lot of itches.
RE: Green Threes
It's wild just how many good creatures there are for that slot now. I feel like we were lacking a bit this time two years ago, but now there's just a bevy of riches. I really liked Deathgorge Scavenger from the new set, but I can't really find a slot for it with so many options I'm currently running that have all shined at different points:
The hydra is good, but not exactly my idea of no-nonsense. I mean to say something that hits play with real stats, and doesn't require any further conditions, hoops, or mana investments. Something like how Polukranos, World Eater or Deadbridge Goliath are to the 4 slot.
I just now realized how disgusting Tireless Tracker is with Famgren Marauder.
On the topic of green 3s, I like how well Nissa, Vastwood Seer plays with Wildfire.
It kind of feels like green 3s are at a spot where you can go a lot of different directions depending on what you're trying to do with the color. The section feels like it's so representative of what green is trying to do in a cube that the 3 drops are the color's heart and soul.
Choosing green 3s really stresses me out.
All of these hypothetical sections are at least justifiable and communicate so much about what the color is trying to accomplish without even looking at the rest of green's cards.
In jest,
On the topic of green 3s, I like how well Nissa, Vastwood Seer plays with Wildfire.
It kind of feels like green 3s are at a spot where you can go a lot of different directions depending on what you're trying to do with the color. The section feels like it's so representative of what green is trying to do in a cube that the 3 drops are the color's heart and soul.
Choosing green 3s really stresses me out.
All of these hypothetical sections are at least justifiable and communicate so much about what the color is trying to accomplish without even looking at the rest of green's cards.
In jest,
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
Still missing
Grillo_Parlante
Contributor
?
Hooting mandrills is great, but you can't cast it turn two off a mana elf, and you often can't reliably cast it on turn three either. After that, it's functionally a three drop, and great for sequencing with other plays.
Chris Taylor
Contributor
I do like the card though. Tasigur kinda poisoned my mind to the power level of delve spells, but Mandrils is good.
I've been running a tweak on it for a while now and he's been good, even though Lucas wants me to switch trample for draw a card
I've been running a tweak on it for a while now and he's been good, even though Lucas wants me to switch trample for draw a card
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
Lucas as in Lucre?
Definitely.
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
Wow, haven't seen him around in ages. How is he?
Chris Taylor
Contributor
Convincing me day after day to cut more aggro cards
I kid. He's good. We've been altrenating cube and board games because of some fatigue from my play group, and as an aside, Tyrants of the Underdark is excellent. I'm rubbish at it, but it's sweet. My only complaint is that everyone's victory points are totally calculable, but it takes a while. So if you wanna disrupt someone, you need to find out who's winning, and you can either sit there for like 5 mins doing some rudimentary addition, or feelcraft it out in a very "Who should I attack in this EDH game" type way, and neither really feels great to me.
Another buddy of mine has actually taken to curating a set of tyrants much in the same way you would a cube, and it was a great moment for me. I love the feeling I get from curating a cube, but if we had two in the same play group we'd be altrenating weeks, people would probably have a favorite, it's usually not a good scene, especially when you aren't cubing weekly. Even if it's not exactly the same as what I (clearly, look at my post count) love, it's scratching the same itch in a similar way.
Brought a tear to my eye it did. My little boys are growing up
I kid. He's good. We've been altrenating cube and board games because of some fatigue from my play group, and as an aside, Tyrants of the Underdark is excellent. I'm rubbish at it, but it's sweet. My only complaint is that everyone's victory points are totally calculable, but it takes a while. So if you wanna disrupt someone, you need to find out who's winning, and you can either sit there for like 5 mins doing some rudimentary addition, or feelcraft it out in a very "Who should I attack in this EDH game" type way, and neither really feels great to me.
Another buddy of mine has actually taken to curating a set of tyrants much in the same way you would a cube, and it was a great moment for me. I love the feeling I get from curating a cube, but if we had two in the same play group we'd be altrenating weeks, people would probably have a favorite, it's usually not a good scene, especially when you aren't cubing weekly. Even if it's not exactly the same as what I (clearly, look at my post count) love, it's scratching the same itch in a similar way.
Brought a tear to my eye it did. My little boys are growing up
My guess for Rivals of Ixalan:
Our characters will find Orazca, the City of Gold. It will be a meld card where you need four cards to assemble the transform land. The backside of the enlarged land will create a token artifact named Immortal Sun which will be super strong and will easily win you the game quite fast.
Lore wise I believe picking up the powerful artifact will conclude in a catastrophe where at least Orazca will fall into ruin. Perhaps the catastrophe will be on a planar scale. Maybe Jace will flee to Dominaria.
Our characters will find Orazca, the City of Gold. It will be a meld card where you need four cards to assemble the transform land. The backside of the enlarged land will create a token artifact named Immortal Sun which will be super strong and will easily win you the game quite fast.
Lore wise I believe picking up the powerful artifact will conclude in a catastrophe where at least Orazca will fall into ruin. Perhaps the catastrophe will be on a planar scale. Maybe Jace will flee to Dominaria.
I played against this in limited, so apply grains of salt where applicable, but it seemed dreadfully slow. Each little facet adds up to make it less than ideal. The fact that you have to tap it, the fact that it's two cards, the fact that it's only the opponent's GY (this one is huge), and the fact that it starts 1/1, not 1/2 or something like that. Any one of these changes, and it's more palatable. The effect itself (explore) being kinda low-impact doesn't help either
It works better in a slower deck where it can be a card-quality engine, but it's hard to read it as a card that would want to go in that sort of deck. A card that pulls this style of effect off much, much better is Grim Lavamancer
It works better in a slower deck where it can be a card-quality engine, but it's hard to read it as a card that would want to go in that sort of deck. A card that pulls this style of effect off much, much better is Grim Lavamancer
Absolutely agreed with sigh, although I would go so far as to contend that the main killer is that it can ONLY target your opponent's graveyard; it might have some hope in a self-mill or shell otherwise, but leaving its ability to have consistent targets entirely up to your opponent's deck and play style is never that great, and there will be games where it just randomly hates on a graveyard deck in a really bizarre fashion, which can be done more surgically and excitingly by many other cards. Easy pass, unfortunately, as I do like the overall concept.
or shell otherwise, but leaving its ability to have consistent targets entirely up to your opponent's deck and play style is never that great, and there will be games where it just randomly hates on a graveyard deck in a really bizarre fashion, which can be done more surgically and excitingly by many other cards. Easy pass, unfortunately, as I do like the overall concept.It's like a poor, poor(!) man's Deathrite Shaman
An excellent point! If you run DRS, it's already performing this role far better.