General Chatcast Topics (feat. CML)

Jason Waddell

Staff member
Uh, so I'm going to play with a big ball of fire and invite CML to do a live (gulp) Chatcast alongside yours truly, where I'll attempt to do my best to reign in the tangents while my guest leads us on tirades that seek to connect the failings of Avacyn Restored limited to Nietzschean philosophy, and we debate which is more likely to happen first: the printing of Return to Eventide or CML sending Zac Hill a Facebook friend request.

If you would like to shape this process I advise you to leave some questions below. We'll take the best (most inflammatory) ones and debate them live (really?) on camera.

I don't have an exact date planned yet, but I am thinking something like Sunday, December 8th at 3pm EST.

James Stevenson

Steamflogger Boss
Staff member
Well I'd really like to hear him explain all his opinions about fascism and mormonism in Ender's Game coherently.

James Stevenson

Steamflogger Boss
Staff member
When I posted earlier I couldn't think of any magic topics I wanted to hear about. But I would like to know what you chaps think about ramp. Where's that sweet green ramp deck gone? It hasn't happened in my cube in a while, maybe it's because my cube is faster now. I don't run stupid rampy artifacts that jump you from turn 3 to turn 8, it's all down to green sorceries, mana elves and a few other creatures. I took Rofellos out because he was making these decks insane. Maybe that's where they went. But anyway we never really talk about supporting green ramp, maybe that's something for the chatcast and/or this forum.


ramp should cost 1.

i'm already fb friends with Zac Hill.

that date might not work due to driving back from portland, let's punt around some other possibilities. i am usually up from 12-4 PST

Jason Waddell

Staff member
We are in fact doing this at the originally planned time. Get your questions in people, otherwise this will be a total failure!
No more Eric? Well I guess you gotta let new dynamics flourish. I always enjoyed where I got the hint of polite disagreement from you two but I can imagine it's a whole different animal with Chris.

I'll think of a good one, but if really love to see more CML 8man dailys. I feel like he is uniquely suited to the monologue.


i sold my modo collection because i thought prices would drop precipitously. obviously they have not

Eric Chan

Hyalopterous Lemure
Staff member
I'm gonna sit this one out, but I'll be tuning in!

My one question for the cast: how do you make green interesting in cube? I know CML has gone on record saying that green is the best / easiest colour to design around, but I disagree. Besides black, I've always had a hell of a time making green interesting, beyond its staples of Dorks, Ramp, and Creatures.
I'm gonna sit this one out, but I'll be tuning in!

My one question for the cast: how do you make green interesting in cube? I know CML has gone on record saying that green is the best / easiest colour to design around, but I disagree. Besides black, I've always had a hell of a time making green interesting, beyond its staples of Dorks, Ramp, and Creatures.
Did Dom say it was the best combo enabler or was that someone else?

I think your environment is pretty different from a number of them Eric. The Graveyard aspect of green is really missing, way less tutoring/sifting, fatty cheating is way less supported in your cube and green doorknobs aren't the best with equipment because there isn't much to speak of. I do like how you've concentrated the canned-armies in green and it is just legitimately more resilient and larger on the field than most colours.

I found where blue excels at creating tempo disparity by making big holes in people's turns green sorta seems to be dead set on cramming more time into the day. Multicoloured green or straight green stuff in the land draft might help. I dig the idea of green having more control over it's draws. I guess you could solve that by making it easier for every colour to play blue lol.

The green section of the cube I'm working on is a serious enabler. The design is decidedly not modern though. I've got this idea in my head that greens cards enable cool things but are sorta progressive in themselves. A rootwalla or wurm discarded to your frantic search are increasing your storm count or digging you deep while they pose significant threats on their own. The cards are also not shabby in themselves. Harvest Wurm Burning Tree Emissary and metamorphose are also kinda cool examples of this.

Green and blue are also the colours that let your other plan work more smoothly or quickly. Like green loves other colours right?


i think gold cards, as lucre has said. though i guess it all depends on what kind of person you are, like, i love zenithing and podding, but not everyone does
what makes green aggro unique other than rancor and having access to sick multicolor cards

i asked a friend and he said land grant but i dont even know how that works in cube

supporting devotion / chroma / color matters

Jason Waddell

Staff member
Undiscussed topics from our last thread:

Powerful artifacts and the problem with Magic's card types

Fact or Fiction: too much fixing in a cube leads to all durdly midrange 4cc & 5cc decks
Cube power level - where do you draw the line?

FSR: Why don't people run double-mana lands?

Makes me think of an idea I have on the back burner: The Misfit Cube. The idea is to balance and design around some archetypes that people (read: Johnnys) have tried to pull of and failed or joked about trying. Stuff like Door to Nothingness, Defenders, Mill, under-represented tribes, etc.
The absolute power level of such a thing would be horrendously low. But, there is plenty of design space to create relative power levels and complex interactions. It could and (if done well) should be fun. I actually think the biggest hurdle is audience perception. Would your play group want to play the Misfit Cube? How quickly would drafters adjust to a very strange format? Are they open to the experience.
The topic of designing for your audience is something I'm actually like to put an article together for at some point, so I'd love to hear ya'lls thoughts on it.

My main thoughts right now are concerning what directions to go with my own pauper or pez list but more often than not when thinking about other people's cubes I've been really interested in the prospects of doubling up on cards people love to play with. I'm thinking pyromancers, witnesses, snapcasters, hybrid beaters, lightning bolt, the sorts of cards lots of decks want and feel really good to play. Especially if they are making archetypes that are historically weaker show a little better. I think there are a lot of problems with this idea but it's something I'm very curious about exploring. Reminds me of elf surpluses, duress clones and how most people are excited to cube with as many wildfire and armageddon like cards as possible.


From another forum post here: The Problem with 4-Drops
we could use irc or connect to the skype call and just chat in the call and not speak out loud
holy shit it has colors because of my client
(13:51:29) mc_usher [] entered the room.
(13:51:41) mc_usher: CML is loud and clear
(13:51:43) anotak: cml is very clear, jason is murky but understandable
(13:51:46) mc_usher: mainly loud
(13:51:50) anotak: also hi
(13:52:24) mc_usher: your diction is wonderful, but the mic is bugging out or sth
(13:52:31) anotak: can you aim the laptop mic more at you? other than that it would be fine
(13:52:48) mc_usher: there's an echo as well
(13:53:08) mc_usher: mute/close the twitch page if you have it open
(13:53:17) mc_usher: it was better previously
(13:53:30) anotak: it wasnt like this last time. i can understand everything, you'll just hear hear it on the archive i guess but this is acceptable to me
(13:53:50) mc_usher: worth a try I guess
(13:55:16) mc_usher: humble Slovenian buddy brags
(13:57:26) anotak: oh cool i get to cube in 2 hours
(13:58:30) platypusplatoon [] entered the room.
(13:59:06) mc_usher: much better
(13:59:10) anotak: yeah its better
(13:59:11) anotak: idk why
(13:59:19) platypusplatoon: hooray!
(13:59:25) anotak: yeah, i dont know why
(13:59:26) mc_usher: ya
(13:59:26) anotak: lol
(13:59:43) riptidelab [] entered the room.
(13:59:51) platypusplatoon: ya i can hear both people fine
(13:59:57) anotak: have you played fighting games
(14:00:11) mode (+o riptidelab) by jtv
(14:01:09) mc_usher: as many as 3
(14:03:41) anotak: this one time i played magic
(14:05:10) anotak: cmlin outta control, is he in the twitch chat?
(14:06:43) boringdoug [] entered the room.
(14:07:00) anotak: how do you feel about cultivate/kodama's
(14:07:56) platypusplatoon: yeah booooo to mana rocks
(14:09:19) anotak: lol phyrexian obliterator
(14:09:44) platypusplatoon: almost every time someone has tried monogreen here, they've 0-3ed
(14:11:28) mc_usher: I don't think mono-g is bad necessarily but it's difficult to assemble in a normal(/good) green section
(14:11:30) boringdoug: playgroups are totally random
(14:11:43) anotak: how do you feel on bloom tender
(14:11:54) anotak: oh right as i said it
(14:12:19) mc_usher: 'CML likes Eventide card'
(14:12:53) riptidelab left the room.
(14:12:56) platypusplatoon: my very first iteration of cube had dungrove elder... it was not pretty
(14:13:04) anotak: primeval titan grabbing mountain and kessig
(14:13:48) mode (-o riptidelab) by jtv
(14:14:19) anotak: could you call MUD a ramp deck
(14:14:30) mc_usher: the only real 'ramp deck' is Nic Fit, which is not a deck
(14:16:08) anotak: could you do like the squadron hawk thing where if you grab grove you get more than 1
(14:16:32) anotak: either one
(14:16:36) changlingbob [] entered the room.
(14:16:53) anotak: thats true
(14:17:34) mc_usher: I like the Scry lands too
(14:18:00) mc_usher: they conform to the fetchland model where they each go in 7 colour pairs
(14:18:39) platypusplatoon: i dunno, i don't see myself playing a tapland in a fast deck when i only want one of the two colors
(14:19:09) anotak: people have really really bad reactions to bonfire
(14:19:29) platypusplatoon: people here really really love bonfire... they're all deviants
(14:19:59) boringdoug: i wanna run the controlly scry lands soon
(14:20:21) platypusplatoon: halimar depths is sweet
(14:20:24) anotak: scry lands are a better designed version of halimar
(14:20:58) platypusplatoon: hmmm, when you put it that way, the scry lands do sound sweet
(14:21:19) anotak: manabond
(14:21:45) platypusplatoon: yep
(14:21:56) iamlucaschilds [] entered the room.
(14:21:59) platypusplatoon: eats gravecrawlers!
(14:22:49) iamlucaschilds: oh come now
(14:23:24) iamlucaschilds: I have no idea how I got home last night but I'm here for the chattercast
(14:24:15) anotak: they didnt print mortify in rtr block for the reason of it being 'too good against theros' though
(14:24:25) platypusplatoon: still waiting for the viridian shaman / manic vandal equivalent that eats enchantments
(14:24:59) anotak: they didnt print mortify in rtr block for the reason of it being 'too good against theros' though
(14:25:00) iamlucaschilds: Where did the name platypusplatoon come from?
(14:25:17) iamlucaschilds: Lol too good 3cc removal
(14:27:09) mc_usher: your utility land draft should consist entirely of Tabernacles at Pendrell Vale
(14:27:52) platypusplatoon: i love green too!
(14:28:01) platypusplatoon: it's just boring in my cube
(14:28:45) iamlucaschilds: Blame modern design
(14:29:25) mc_usher: yeah I love Primeval Titan
(14:30:27) iamlucaschilds: Man primal command one of the last standard cards I played
(14:30:40) iamlucaschilds: that and first garruk and cameleon colossus
(14:31:16) iamlucaschilds: I just don't get pod
(14:31:39) platypusplatoon: man i loved those cards, i was just getting back into standard after ~12 years away from magic, i couldn't believe green cards were _good_ now
(14:32:07) iamlucaschilds: What is tanky
(14:32:12) iamlucaschilds: what is mean please
(14:33:42) anotak: i think you need to support loam
(14:33:43) platypusplatoon: i don't think anyone here knows what to do with loam
(14:33:44) mc_usher: Loam was going to be my card for the contest
(14:34:29) anotak: dom did you see my loam cube
(14:34:41) anotak:
(14:35:07) mc_usher: interesting
(14:35:29) iamlucaschilds: That was a strategy in original ravnica
(14:36:00) anotak: i havent printed it out yet so i havent played with it... also i dont know if my chats are showing up for everyone so im going to relink it just because its not showing up jason's window so idk if it sent
(14:36:39) mc_usher: Podding Redcap into Gray Merchant is a wonderful feeling
(14:37:00) iamlucaschilds: You have 3+ Pods in your cube and no one has 3-0 with a pod in their deck yet?
(14:37:37) mc_usher: Nykthos has been consistently fantastic for me in the devotion experiment
(14:39:09) iamlucaschilds: You just have so many of them
(14:39:30) iamlucaschilds: maybe reduce the number of pods if it is being a dud in many draughts
(14:39:54) anotak: zero is tied for the best character in umvc3 but it took like 1.5 years for anyone to win a major tournament playing him
(14:39:55) mc_usher: maybe Pod prompts people to built their deck around doing sweet things with Pod instead of maximizing their chances of winning (more so than usual?)
(14:40:43) iamlucaschilds: I like hannes taste in music
(14:41:47) boringdoug: pretty sure just untapping with meloku was enough for me
(14:41:48) platypusplatoon: someone did meloku with shelldock isle too, they did not lose that game
(14:42:18) iamlucaschilds: Tapping isn't really a build around, it's just great if you have more cards than your opponent. Opposition is also just a super fair card when you are playing from behind
(14:42:36) mc_usher: if they weren't playing them, it shouldn't affect the speed of your Cube in theory
(14:43:06) iamlucaschilds: can anyone tell me why it's called little kid
(14:43:12) mc_usher: on 3 Hierarch 2 BoP 2 DRS 1 Treespeaker as my mana guys
(14:43:13) iamlucaschilds: also whats benny beatdown
(14:43:56) iamlucaschilds: I heart flash guys
(14:44:57) iamlucaschilds: wolfir avanger is actually pretty good when you make regenerating relevant
(14:48:45) anotak: i like that thread a lot
(14:50:06) iamlucaschilds: I think karoos help aggro in that they make my stone rains and vensers more mean
(14:50:38) platypusplatoon: wait, jason had a dragon cube at one point...?
(14:53:11) platypusplatoon: i still have to read the back side every time
(14:53:24) mc_usher: it somehow has more abilities than Bow of Nylea
(14:54:09) anotak: Bow of Nylea, Planeswalker
(14:55:39) platypusplatoon: i do 14 card packs in my cube drafts... *runs away*
(14:56:27) anotak: someone won the maze i forgot who. yeah, my friend's peasant cube is 14 card packs. my loam cube is that i havent drafted is theoretically 17 card packs (lol)
(14:58:58) anotak: i want the gravecrawler of green aggro
(14:59:29) anotak: theres rancor? i guess
(14:59:41) mc_usher: Auras in general have been good for me
(14:59:46) anotak: nacatl is multicolor card
(15:00:01) mc_usher: Moldervine Cloak, Elephant Guide, BOAR UMBRA
(15:01:18) iamlucaschilds: Is the dryad a real card?
(15:01:48) anotak: green gets splashed but its never a main color of a 3 color aggro deck
(15:02:07) iamlucaschilds: no but ramp or green contol is a lot better when it has early pressure / big board presence
(15:02:15) boringdoug: I used to be really interested in green aggro but actually what's he point... Just because there's a color doesn't mean you need aggro in that color
(15:02:33) boringdoug: isn't kind of the point of having different colors is not to have them be the same?
(15:04:05) anotak: i wasnt serious about using land grant, my friend said that
(15:04:11) iamlucaschilds: add land grant to the land draught
(15:04:58) anotak: that's why making it unique is important, but yeah i'm not trying to make it different for the sake of being different. people said a lot of the stuff you're saying about green aggro about black aggro before the gravecrawlers stuff
(15:06:17) anotak: ah its not showing up for jason's screen: that's why making it unique is important, but yeah i'm not trying to make it different for the sake of being different. people said a lot of the stuff you're saying about green aggro about black aggro before the gravecrawlers stuff
(15:08:50) platypusplatoon: the chat is really glitchy, the messages showing up for me and jason have very little overlap
(15:09:10) anotak: yeah same
(15:09:14) platypusplatoon: ya, nothing we can do
(15:09:47) mc_usher: I made the Seal of Fire switch
(15:09:57) mc_usher: it's been... kinda bad
(15{10}55) mc_usher: it's been kinda bad
(15:11:36) iamlucaschilds: Chris should love seal of flame, it's a great answer to eight and a half tails
(15:12:50) anotak: we should use something other than twitch chat for the chat aspect next time
(15:13:01) iamlucaschilds: You're a texan?
(15:13:02) mc_usher: so many Latin students here, I love it
(15:13:23) iamlucaschilds: I don't know ***
(15:13:30) iamlucaschilds: man living in the south sounds like fun
(15:13:50) changlingbob left the room.
(15:13:52) anotak: its not fucking fun fuck alabama
(15:14:31) iamlucaschilds: Like I imagine it's very different from toronto and it would tickle me and I'd probably be beaten up for being such a ponce
(15:14:43) mc_usher: I'm not actually convinced by Fanatic but Purphoros is great
(15:15:45) boringdoug: cml your laugh is manic
(15:16:07) iamlucaschilds: I pass koth all the time for cards that feel less demanding
(15:16:29) iamlucaschilds: like red 4s are available
(15:17:48) mc_usher: get the rant clock
(15:18:04) platypusplatoon: BETTER THAN KOTH
(15:18:31) platypusplatoon: aw man my chat doesn't show up for jason anymore :'(
(15:18:47) iamlucaschilds: there it goes
(15:18:57) boringdoug: on the internet nobody knows I'm a cat
(15:19:45) anotak: that sounds like hearthstone
(15:19:48) platypusplatoon: ya, that would be sweet
(15:20:01) platypusplatoon: get rid of those enchantments
(15:20:19) anotak: yes its not as good as magic
(15:20:36) iamlucaschilds: Dude CML streaming hearthstone
(15:20:55) platypusplatoon: it's coming
(15:21:09) iamlucaschilds: I wana hear the exasperation
(15:25:20) anotak: double elim owns for fighting games but a very very very long fighting game set will take like... 10 minutes? its too slow of a format for magic or whatever
(15:26:49) mc_usher: dead air was fine back when you had pros coming into the booth and talking about things organically; instead we have either cringeworthy attempts to fill dead air, or some awful prepared segment
(15:27:10) anotak: didnt show up so: (15:25:20) anotak: double elim owns for fighting games but a very very very long fighting game set will take like... 10 minutes? its too slow of a format for magic or whatever
(15:27:47) platypusplatoon: aw man, need to get out the editing software now
(15:29:15) anotak: this reminds me of christian music
(15:33:35) boringdoug: cml, where should I go for poker content? I'm so terrible at it and when I play I play with a bunch of mathematicians. I need to read something
(15:34:13) mc_usher:
(15:36:06) boringdoug: swag thanks bros
(15:36:46) anotak: getting good at games is hard
(15:37:19) mc_usher: you can make a living off breaking even at poker via rakeback, or at least you could before
(15:37:57) anotak: brb
(15:39:07) mc_usher: I have a bunch of good poker ebooks I can send
(15:39:20) mc_usher: so send me details, all
(15:39:51) boringdoug: hit me up: *email edited*
(15:43:08) iamlucaschilds: I guess I could use a link banner on magic sites
(15:44:00) iamlucaschilds: no way man it's generating a brand
(15:44:17) iamlucaschilds: keep harrying them
(15:45:30) boringdoug: bye!
(15:46:35) platypusplatoon left the room.
(15:48:46) mc_usher left the room.
(15:51:53) iamlucaschilds left the room.
(15:58:05) The account has disconnected and you are no longer in this chat. You will automatically rejoin the chat when the account reconnects.


i do not know how to disable sound for chrome and couldn't learn in time to have the twitch window open. i apologize for the questions i missed on account of my luddite ineptitude!