General Community cuts thread

Erik Twice

Erik Twice

One of the hardest parts of building a cube is that we build them for other people. And those people may have a different perspective or see things differently from you. Cards we like or archetypes that seem obvious to us may not be for others or not seem fun to them at all.

So here's an excercise:

1) Check the previous' poster cube
2) Suggest two cards to cut

That's it!
 
Onderzeeboot

Onderzeeboot

Ecstatic Orb
Erik Twice said:
1) Check the previous' poster cube
2) Suggest two cards to cut

That's it!
Click to expand...


You are running only 6 equipment in a 405 card cube, none of which cost more than 3 mana. I think this card is a trap. Yes, it can be useful, but it's also extremely narrow in your cube, and there's nothing on the level of Batterskull to cheat out.


This is the ultimate burn card for traditional monored burn decks, but a) your players are unlikely to draft a monored deck, and b) you don't nearly run the density of burn spells to support this type of deck. I feel there have to be other interesting burn spells that don't offer you a choice between crippling your own mana base or paying six mana for the paltry return of investment of four damage.
 
Chris Taylor

Chris Taylor

Contributor
Laz said:
Primary 360
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I've run this card for a while, and it's alright to proliferate, but end of the day it's about as interesting/powerful as lava spike. Both in terms of power level and gameplay, I think you can do better.


Be nicer to people :p

Laz said:
Scuttle Cube
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Come on man, this is the perfect power level and theme for Addle :p


Why?

Laz said:
Lucre Cube
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There's gotta be a better like, totem armor thing that could go here :p


This could be way cuter :p
 
silasw

silasw

@Chris Taylor:


This seems like a really awkward counters payoff. Not a fan of the double-green cost, plus it's awkward on the curve because you want to play it after the stuff that has counters.

Without any crazy lands in the cube like Academy Ruins, Gaea's Cradle, etc, 3 copies of Field feels unnecessary to me. The creature-lands are probably not going to run away with too many games.


Edit: Damn, got sniped by another comment right before mine.
 
Erik Twice

Erik Twice

Your cube seems solid Silsaw, there's not much I would cut. Two suggestions:




Everytime I face Oketra on Magic Arena, my enjoyment of the game drops like a rock. It's one of those cards that you either answer immediately or lose except it comes keeps coming back. For five mana a 3/5 double strike is already huge, but it creates 4/4 each time you cast another creature. In other words, you can't attack into it and you'll lose if you don't. Really dislike the card. The same goes for the other Eternals, to be honest.



This is a vanilla creature unless you have 10 mana. I don't see it being played in a cube with Planeswalkers, God-Eternals and Eldrazi around.

@Onderzeeboot

You are probably right on both cards. I'll take them out and see how it goes.
 
astraedm

astraedm

@Nanonox



Tends to do either nothing or destroy aggro decks with 1 card. I love 1 mana equipment, but that one is too feast or famine (heh) in my opinion.



Nearly impossible to interact with and a boring win condition for control decks. There are so many cool things you can be doing in UR and an uninteractable howling mine that kills them can't be the gameplay experience you want. Also, compare it in power level to stuff like Storm the Vault in your multicolored section, which is much more interesting.
 
O

opeless

Always happy to receive feedback on my cube, so looking forward to the next post - but for astraedm, the two cards I'd cut are:



which just seems too slow even with Tinker etc, given the set-up required, too.

And:



...which I didn't see enough enablers for (but maybe I'm missing something)

Nice cube though, there's some interesting choices in there!
 
ravnic

ravnic



Is this really worth it in an environment with StP/Path? What about Temporal Isolation?




Yeah, it's just an uneducated guess since I've never played this card, but it seems pretty low impact. Don't run cards just to complete "cycles", especially at 720.



Next person, please look over my main cube :)
 
Latro

Latro


Well that or Warfire Javelineer, as they both do the same thing for the same mana cost, one just does it better.


I didn't get the impression this was ramping to anything in particular, the green lands theme seems a more interesting ramp variant, and if I was drafting something cute with artifacts I'd prefer the colored mana your signets offer.
 
Latro

Latro

Dang, must've put it in the wrong place - guess I'll put it in my sig.

Hillstyle;

You have 2 more interesting versions of creatures granting evasion in Tetsuko Umezawa, fugitive and Mistfire Adept, maybe replace it with some non-creature evasion granting? (Or something on ETB?)


I saw like one artifact making card in black - I'd say add some more incidental support in black, bulk up your artifacts, or cut.
 
japahn

japahn



Either runs away with the game or feels bad. It doesn't feel right to your cube's power level.



Turns games that are already lost into an hour-long loss. The game becomes a painful hopeless grind much more often than it creates interesting situations.
 
Erik Twice

Erik Twice



I don't think you run enough artifacts to support this card. I think it's a trap.





I believe this card will push Red very hard. Given the low power level of your cube, I don't think you should run it.
 
Onderzeeboot

Onderzeeboot

Ecstatic Orb
Laz said:
Feldon of the Third Path: Do you really need the repeatable play pattern?
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Lord, yes! Feldon connects a lot of themes. Cards from the discard theme feed it with creatures to reanimate, cards from the artifact theme interact favorable with the tokens it creates. I really like the play patterns as well, and find it much less repetitive than you would think. Also, it has but 3 toughness, it's not that hard to take care off. Just yesterday, as I was testing out new cards from M20, I assembled Feldon + Marauding Raptor + Needletooth Raptor, and it was glorious :)

Laz said:
Mana Tithe: What is this doing for you?
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Good question. I like the unexpected counterspell out of white, but it's probably a cuttable card. People do like it though, and it does get played regularly.

Erik Twice said:
Pick two!
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Okay, I will!



This just feels like one of the worse variants of this effect... Okay, Aysen Bureaucrats is a thing I guess... Anyway, there's also Gideon's Lawkeeper, my personal favorite Law-Rune Enforcer, and Squall Drifter, which all feel more on par with the rest of your white section than Master Decoy.



Do you really need people to accelerate out a six drop on turn 3 and stomp all over your format's aggro decks?
 
Erik Twice

Erik Twice

Master Decoy is worse than other, generally newer, effects of the same type because it cost 2. But it has been working very well and I like the historic value of the card more than I like making the effect a little bit better.

As for Monolith, it's probably getting cut at some point. I like the card quite a bit, despite it being busted and for a long time it has been fine thanks to not having the usual turn 3 targets (There are no planeswalkers, for example and it's not worth it to accelerate into Arcanis the Omnipotent). But now that I'm adding gearhulks, and revising my 6-drops it's probably going to get significantly better and I may end having to cut it.

Thanks a lot for your comments! I'll give your cube a look as soon as I can :)
 
Erik Twice

Erik Twice

I'm going to say that I've been dissapointed by Restoration Gearsmith.



Here's the issue: This is a solid card but also one that I would not pick over a removal spell, a hatebear like Sin Collector or even a blink spell. Part of the reason is that the 4cc slot is very crowded and you always end up with more cards in that spot that you can actually support. You can run Braids, Smokestack, Sorin, Nekrataal, Hostage Taker and between those and 5cc spells, I never felt I wanted Restoration Gearsmith despite the 3/3 body being relevant. It's cooler than picking up Bonesplitter or a discard spell, but it does less for you.




I've seen this card while checking out your cube and drafting it and I've always been surprised because it's a really awful card. It was unplayable in Ixalan draft and I don't see a reason why it would be more playable in your cube environment. In general, I think some of the 3cc mana rocks you have are of fairly questionable value because 1 extra mana and an extremely minor benefit are not worth the cost of pursuing a strategy that requires them. For example, I don't think these mana rocks really help Wildfire, the cost of one card and your third turn is not worth one extra mana and 1 life, for example.
 
Onderzeeboot

Onderzeeboot

Ecstatic Orb
Erik Twice said:
I'm going to say that I've been dissapointed by Restoration Gearsmith.



Here's the issue: This is a solid card but also one that I would not pick over a removal spell, a hatebear like Sin Collector or even a blink spell. Part of the reason is that the 4cc slot is very crowded and you always end up with more cards in that spot that you can actually support. You can run Braids, Smokestack, Sorin, Nekrataal, Hostage Taker and between those and 5cc spells, I never felt I wanted Restoration Gearsmith despite the 3/3 body being relevant. It's cooler than picking up Bonesplitter or a discard spell, but it does less for you.
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Fair.



Erik Twice said:


I've seen this card while checking out your cube and drafting it and I've always been surprised because it's a really awful card. It was unplayable in Ixalan draft and I don't see a reason why it would be more playable in your cube environment. In general, I think some of the 3cc mana rocks you have are of fairly questionable value because 1 extra mana and an extremely minor benefit are not worth the cost of pursuing a strategy that requires them. For example, I don't think these mana rocks really help Wildfire, the cost of one card and your third turn is not worth one extra mana and 1 life, for example.
Click to expand...

3 cmc mana rocks (and 5 mana wraths) are a cornerstone of my environment. I'll admit that I added some cheaper, conditional wraths since, but I think the principle still holds. Anyway, I run no 2 cmc rocks whatsoever, but I agree Orazca Relic is probably one of the weaker in my cube. My experience with them is that they are actually worth it. Then again, my mana rock section is nothing like yours, so I can understand the sentiment. In any case, it's likely to get cut for Fountain of Ichor. The other 3 cmc rock I'm not entirely in love with is actually the custom Chromatic Prism, because it's more often than not a Manalith with useless trinket text. Rest of them, great :)
 
Onderzeeboot

Onderzeeboot

Ecstatic Orb
Rasmus Källqvist said:
Since it seems Onderzeeboot and Erik Twice have given each other suggestions, would anybody be up for finding 2 cards in my just finished cube rebuild?

http://www.cubetutor.com/viewcube/146326

I'm pretty happy with the result of the list, so I'm interested in hearing what 2 cards I can cut.
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Erik Twice actually suggested 2 cuts from japahn's cube, then I suggested 2 for Erik's cube, and then Erik suggested 2 cuts from my cube. I think it's only fair you suggest 2 cuts for Erik's cube if you want suggestions for your cube. Work for it! :p
 
Erik Twice

Erik Twice

Don't be afraid to make suggestions, just having someone's opinion on the cube is more appreciated. Either way,



Like japahn, you don't run enough artifacts to make Cranial Plating playable. You run 34, which is very low, but it's even less in practice because most of them are either weak picks (Terrarion) or very expensive (Staff of Nin, Duplicant). I don't think it's physically possible to make the card work even if you could handpick the cards from your cube. The same applies to Toolcraft Exemplar who goes in the same deck.

Looking at the cube, there are a lot of artifact-centered cards that just don't have the right support. Welder is a complete trap, for example.

Some additional thoughts:

I've drafted your cube twice and I didn't have any mana fixing either time. At a glance, you run three sets of lands which could be seen as enough except the lands you include are bouncelands or come into play tapped for a minor benefit. This makes it very difficult to play creatures on a curve.
 
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