General Fight Club
- Thread starter Jason Waddell
- Start date
In that case, I would say approach is definitely the better option. Alt wins are both more fun and less annoying than humility effects, especially if you have counterspells/other anti-approach cards in your list.
Which of these would you most likely play in a regular blue deck without any landfall triggers?
Living Tsunami I guess? None of these are very exciting.
Depending on the power level of your creatures, Soratami Rainshaper could be fine, but you would need to have a really weak creature base for anyone to consider playing it without any sort of synergy.
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
I think Sea Drake only really works in decks that can mitigate the drawback. Setting yourself back by two lands is a downright disaster! I mean, it's a great play off of a turn one Black Lotus, or off of a Mox Sapphire plus an Ancient Tomb, but I wouldn't want to touch it otherwise without any synergies in my deck. The Living Tsunami, likewise, has a really significant drawback, because if you're playing it on curve you will never get past four mana. If you don't have synergies, that's a pretty significant drawback. Maybe it has a better use case on turn six, where you can keep Counterspell mana open? Soratami Rainshaper has the most agreeable drawback (i.e. none), but a 2/1 flyer for three mana is retail limited power level. That might be enough in your cube, I don't know, it does have evasion after all. Still, the activated ability is expensive enough that it seriously hampers your ability to keep the mana up for it while also trying to build a board state.
Okay, I mean, these cards are obviously considered because of the 
Landfall deck, where you run them alongside Tatyova, Benthic Druid and Wayward Swordtooth. I actually think the Rainshaper could be great there, because it protects the key creatures, but all of those would probably do well in a dedicated landfall deck.I just wanted to know, if another deck could be interested in one of them. Maybe Sea Drake could be decent in a Skies deck when played alongside something elese on turn 5+? Or maybe I should just add Deprive instead.
Landfall deck, where you run them alongside Tatyova, Benthic Druid and Wayward Swordtooth. I actually think the Rainshaper could be great there, because it protects the key creatures, but all of those would probably do well in a dedicated landfall deck.I just wanted to know, if another deck could be interested in one of them. Maybe Sea Drake could be decent in a Skies deck when played alongside something elese on turn 5+? Or maybe I should just add Deprive instead.Okay, I mean, these cards are obviously considered because of the
I think you're getting too caught up looking for synergy for this deck and missing the larger picture of your environment. Although I wouldn't call your list high powered, it is not low powered enough for a lot of the mono-U landfall enablers to be good, or even playable in some cases.
I think Deprive would work very well with what your list's power level. It's an extra copy of Counterspell for hard control lists outside of just being useful in landfall. Tragic Lesson is another card I can see being useful in both control and landfall. It's free land gas in addition to instant speed card draw.
You could also go with Kefnet the Mindful. He doubles as both a control finisher and another way of "digging up" lands. He might be a little oppressive for your list though, it looks like White is really the only color that can permanently remove him.
I would consider Dreamscape Artist for this slot. It's a really explosive enabler for the landfall deck, but it also has synergy with general graveyard and discard strategies.
You could also just go with the spiciest option available...
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
The thing I find interesting about cards like those two you posted here is how format warping they have to be to be playable in the average deck, and as such acting as a sort of catalysts for including incidentally supporting cards (playable artifacts and red cards that happen to put artifacts into play).
I think these cards serve an important function in giving the draft more depth, because it gives a fun mini game after picking one up to try find supporting cards, and seeing them all there where you initially might've missed out on them all making artifacts.
I think the same sort of goers for cards like champion of parish and Thalia's lieutenant, how they give incidental additional value to good creatures that are also humans.
I think these cards serve an important function in giving the draft more depth, because it gives a fun mini game after picking one up to try find supporting cards, and seeing them all there where you initially might've missed out on them all making artifacts.
I think the same sort of goers for cards like champion of parish and Thalia's lieutenant, how they give incidental additional value to good creatures that are also humans.
Let's say I'm trying to make an artifact-y aggro deck happen.
Do I need a high-risk high-reward card or a more consistent but less exciting incentive card?
(Or both, even?)
I think both could be the right answer easily, depending on how deep you wanna go here. But for me, I'd always add the more flexible card first, which is Galvanic Blast in my opinion. If you want to up your artifact count, you could also consider this one:
It is pretty sweet with artifact recursion being part of your artifact package.
I think you are correct. I'm just a little concerned, that blue might not have enough to offer to keep up with green, but it's not worth adding cards, that make the meta worse. Also, you have listed a few really neat options I'm not running yet! I really like Tragic Lesson, since it is not only a good filler in basically every other blue deck, but also the
Dredge deck and the Madness deck (for a more midrange-y version) are bleeding into , plus I'm going to run Drake Haven with my next update, so the option to discard is also valuable.My next choice would probably be Deprive (because it's still basically Counterspell) or Dreamscape Artist (I like repeatable Harrow), if I can find room for another one. Kefnet does seem a little oppressive, and Sunder seems fun but ultimately just to be a more narrow Upheaval (which the landfall deck loves!)
The spiciest option available is obviously
Great card is great! But I'm already running it alongside quite a few other blue land bounce cards
The first 5 are awesome and get my recommendations for everyone who's running a similar theme. Overburden has yet to see the light of a draft.
And you know, it's fine if one color in an archetype doesn't add as much to that strategy to the other. In my current U/G section, decks try and untap lands with mana enchantments. Green is the core of the strategy, but most of the decks still play a lot of blue.
As long as you have a fun deck in the color pair, it doesn't matter if both colors are carrying an equal amount of support for it. It's more important to create a healthy meta overall.
VS1. Rate these two cards using The Thanos Approach.
2. Which one of these cards do you think is more interesting as a black 4-drop. Kezz is less powerful, but seems a little bit cooler. Spawn just seems kinda bomby, but in a way that could be interesting to play with.
Spawn Of Mayhem
Curving out a T3 Spawn feels like a 9. You need to remove this threat immediately or you lose the game. It's not a 10 because although spectacle accelerates the game, it doesn't make an impact the turn it gets played.
On T4, maybe not quite as drastic, there's more likely to be flyers out, removal is online, card smoothing lets the villain find their answers a bit more easily. Potential to win on its own, but beatable without support (i.e. spectacle).
Kezzerdrix
I haven't played against Kezzerdix, or been aware of his existence until now. But I think on your scale I place him at 4. There's counterplay to the upkeep trigger, and more importantly it doesn't have evasion. There's probably games where he's good, but it's not every game or every format.
I see the play pattern on this guy being:
1. Villian plays chump blocker.
2. Blocks, Kezz deals no damage, kills the blocker.
3. Upkeep you take 4 after killing your opponents only creature. Or, you just can't swing.
Curving out a T3 Spawn feels like a 9. You need to remove this threat immediately or you lose the game. It's not a 10 because although spectacle accelerates the game, it doesn't make an impact the turn it gets played.
On T4, maybe not quite as drastic, there's more likely to be flyers out, removal is online, card smoothing lets the villain find their answers a bit more easily. Potential to win on its own, but beatable without support (i.e. spectacle).
Kezzerdrix
I haven't played against Kezzerdix, or been aware of his existence until now. But I think on your scale I place him at 4. There's counterplay to the upkeep trigger, and more importantly it doesn't have evasion. There's probably games where he's good, but it's not every game or every format.
I see the play pattern on this guy being:
1. Villian plays chump blocker.
2. Blocks, Kezz deals no damage, kills the blocker.
3. Upkeep you take 4 after killing your opponents only creature. Or, you just can't swing.
Fitting to that topic, I might have another fight.
I vote Urban Evolution, because it's a much cleaner card and I think partner is really clumsy in a draft.
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
I run Ravos, Soultender, and it's a great card, despite the annoying partner. I think we shouldn't let ourself get distracted by the extraneous text, if the card fits, it fits. I have never met a drafter who had any problems with ignoring the partner part.
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
I don't know. Is the fail state too bad? Still a decent top deck, and with the 3 power it certainly is more relevant on the battlefield.
Chris Taylor
Contributor
Kavu Climber is a solid card. not a bad fail case at all
