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Jason Waddell

Jason Waddell

Administrator
Staff member
Dom Harvey said:
This is a question for my Cube, but I know other people run similar setups and I'm curious to hear your thoughts. At the moment I have the 20 fetches/20 [duals/shocks] configuration, supplemented with a variety of lands for each colour pair (some filters, some manlands, some bouncelands, etc). Most of those fill fairly unique roles so I'm happy with them. My problem is that colour combos like R/W, B/W, U/G still have comparatively poor manafixing; does it make sense iyo to just add another fetch or dual in those colour combos, and, if so, which? (i.e. does 3 Sacred Foundry 2 Arid Mesa helps R/W decks more than 3 Arid Mesa 2 Sacred Foundry? Yes, right?)
Click to expand...

If you want to help Boros specifically, a Shock will help more than a fetch.
 
Dom Harvey

Dom Harvey

Contributor
It seems like the shock helps that specific colour pair more, whereas the fetch helps every other colour pair more.
 
Chris Taylor

Chris Taylor

Contributor
another sacred foundry will help RW decks and RW decks only (also Naya, etc. Decks that are actually both red and white)
Another Arid Mesa will help any deck playing white OR red (since it can find godless shrine, for eg) But, it also makes landfall guys better, the majority of which are in red/white (Since most people play steppe lynx and plated geopede, but barely anyone plays vinelasher kudzu)

I like another mesa better, but if you're more concerned with R/W specifically than the overall cube, another foundry works well.
I imagine the difference is really slight though :p
 
Lucre

Lucre

Can you explain why you feel some colour still have poor fixing when it should feel even? Is your saturation of WW extra high or something?

2x Fetch 2x shocklands (I like that it feels punishing)
I have an extra slot for bouncelands in storm colours lands matter colours, WB and WR have a filter land and RG has an extra stomping ground because it has apes and whatever.
 
CML

CML

Contributor
today i played a power cube for the first time. power cubes lack things that i value in games of magic, such as interaction. i imagine there is no way to really fix this.
 
Jason Waddell

Jason Waddell

Administrator
Staff member
I have so many scientific questions when it comes to online dating. What's the highest density of emoticon usage in a girls' message before it becomes a red flag? Some girls use smileys almost in lieu of punctuation. If the rate converges on (or exceeds) one emoticon per sentence, does that concern you? Is smiley density correlated with attraction? Will a girl use fewer smileys with a guy she is less interested in?

Does the specific smiley used (ie.
Code: 
:) or ;) or :p or :D
) correlate somehow with religious or political beliefs? Sexual deviancy?

Are girls who use the reverse smiley
Code: 
(:
more likely to be committed to a mental institution later on in life?
 
Dom Harvey

Dom Harvey

Contributor
Lucas: Green has ramp/fixing, Blue has card draw/manipulation to find lands. R/W generally wants to curve out as fast as possible, so it can't afford to wait to draw the colour it needs; B/W suffers because black and white both tend to have stringent mana requirements.

If I remove stuff like painlands/Scarslands, I get this configuration:
2 Celestial Colonnade, 2 Flooded Strand, 2 Hallowed Fountain, Azorius Chancery, (Mystic Gate?)
2 Creeping Tar Pit, 2 Polluted Delta, 2 Watery Grave, Dimir Aqueduct, Sunken Ruins
2 Bloodstained Mire, 2 Blood Crypt, Graven Cairns, (? more Mires/Crypts? another Cairns maybe?)
2 Wooded Foothills, 2 Stomping Ground, Grove of the Burnwillows
1 Stirring Wildwood, 2 Windswept Heath, 2 Temple Garden, Horizon Canopy
2 Marsh Flats, 2 Godless Shrine, Fetid Heath
2 Verdant Catacombs, 2 Overgrown Tomb, Twilight Mire
2 Misty Rainforest, 2 Breeding Pool, Flooded Grove
2 Scalding Tarn, 2 Steam Vents, Cascade Bluffs, Izzet Boilerworks
2 Arid Mesa, 2 Sacred Foundry

so UW (7/8), UB (8), BR (5), RG (5), GW (6), WB (5), BG (5), GU (5), UR (6), RW (4)

This is clearly uneven, and the colour combinations with the lowest amount of manafixing are the ones that need it most. I guess my question is, is there a compelling reason to play e.g. Battlefield Forge over another Sacred Foundry, given that Foundry is arguably a better land than Forge by itself and lets the RW deck find more fixing in the form of any other fetchland (and also works with Eternal Dragon, KotR, etc); and, if I'm adding more shocks, which colour pairs would want an added fetchland instead?
 
Jason Waddell

Jason Waddell

Administrator
Staff member
I don't think from the perspective of any one color pair that a fetchland is ever preferable to a shock. Sacred Foundy's almost always go to Boros, and Arid Mesas go everywhere. I think perhaps you need to look at the whole environment in addition to just looking through one set of lenses.
 
James Stevenson

James Stevenson

Steamflogger Boss
Staff member
Dom Harvey

Dom Harvey

Contributor
That's what I'm asking: given that I want a certain amount of fetchlands and rough parity between the manafixing available to each colour, which colour pairs get landed with the fetches? Can RG 'afford' to have another Wooded Foothills over another Stomping Ground in order to make WR's mana better?

I think powered Cube can be fine, but it requires the same density of answers and cheap interaction that people seen as authorities on Cube always say is needed for aggro cards. Most powered Cubes don't have that, though; it's just people flinging haymakers at each other.
 
CML

CML

Contributor
Dom: re. powered Cubes you had not only the exact same thought as me ca 23 PST last night but expressed it in exactly the same language. I dunno how you feel about this, but there it is. The subtext to my post above is that I'm not sure how one would go about solving the 'haymaker' problem. One doesn't just simply play a Lotus to power out a Cryptic Command, after all ... though I guess it might be possible what with much of Vintage being control and/or prison decks. (Anyway, I think the poster child for this kind of cube is Mana Drain, which has the primary feature of cheating on mana costs and the secondary one of being a counterspell.)

I like that you've doubled up on Manlands though I'm not sure it's necessary. And then WHERE OH WHERE IS RAGING RAVINE??
 
CML

CML

Contributor
i've always wondered what a 4/4 vigilant flier would look like in jund, a 3/2 unblockable in uwr, and a 3/3 that pumped on every attack in UB.
 
Alex Blanton

Alex Blanton

Psychological statistics shows you a lot of interesting things that you never wanted to know or think about. There's probably a professor right now in some prestigious university somewhere in the world being paid to research the relevance of Freudian psychology and electronic romantic comingling and its effects on ... ... ...

It was really hard concentrating when I had to read those things. Sure, SOME of them are riveting, but a lot of the shocking stuff is banned now. Take a look at this and say you know what you'd do.
 
CML

CML

Contributor
i am deeply uncomfortable with the idea that an individual can betray an institution, though i've seen the converse happen hundreds of times
 
CML

CML

Contributor
on a more serious note i will share with you a profound lesson i have learned from cube design. it is not often that one has the pleasure of too few cards in the 405, but it's usually when a fall set turns out to kinda suck. but in those cases you must seize the day and not waste those empty slots! fill them all with THE LARGEST CREATURES YOU CAN FIND (under CMC9) and make merry. everyone loves fattiez
 
Dom Harvey

Dom Harvey

Contributor
Not sure Zac Hill could be any worse in that discussion if he tried (though if he did try he'd probably be bad at it, so...)
 
CML

CML

Contributor
zac's kind of a trag really, contrary to popular belief he isn't an ironclad narcissist in person or anything, he's fairly bright and engaging. like a lot of the people i meet at other game stores, he's just terrible as a public figure due to the culture (which of course is itself a failure and something he's complicit in, but you know -- it's a lesser failure, i think.)

he seemed to have some insight into this mechanism in this article (http://www.starcitygames.com/articl...y-Journey-To-And-From-The-Promising-Land.html), except he ... replicated that same mechanism with self-parodic verve and the consistency of north korean propaganda. i guess one doesn't simply turn in your library card, STOP BEING A WIZARDS EMPLOYEE ...

EDIT: in the interests of fairness i should also say that Zac was a tremendous MTG designer (from what I know), ditto McCall and those other guys who are equally capable of producing the Modo Cube on one end and Modern Masters on another. M14's flaws i heard attributed to Zac's leaving and nobody being able to 'step in' and properly develop the set.
 
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