I'm in love with Demand Answers. It reminds me of Bitter Triumph in its modality in terms of cost, and goodness knows I have enough trinket tokens running around to justify it.
Sets (MKM) Murders at Karlov Manor Previews
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Agreed x2
Here's me hoping to get something simple like a Coral Eel that investigates when it enters the battlefield.
Sentences you'd only formulate in magic context.
Chris Taylor
Contributor
I know you don't mean this with that level of specificity, but the idea of a creature - fish detective makes me laugh
Doesn't matter much. Mostly it's nice to have it all in one thread
I didn't even realize there were two threads until right now lol.
Good it's fixed!
Good it's fixed!
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
No, should be Manor, not Manner
Heh, didn't even notice. Fixed!No, should be Manor, not Manner
I really hope the Green sorcery that you can have any number of copies of is actually a cool build-around, kinda like Dragon's Approach.
It will for sure be something that is beneficial to have multiples of. So by that definition it can be a build-around-me card. I don’t know what you consider cool but I will agree that Dragon’s Approach is a cool card!
Thank you @ravnic for posting this.
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Sounds like we Morph'n boys!
Morph is probably the most popular mechanic from the late old-border era. It's fun to play with but it sorely needs a refresh.
I must admit I have almost never see anyone play with morph cards since they were Standard legal.
I think they're tricky to make work in cube because it's hard to find a large set of them that work within the same power band and the element of surprise doesn't really work if they're not sufficiently dense in an environment. I tried to make it work for a bit but there were a lot of "Oh that's obviously Bane of the Living because my opponent is playing black" type moments. Plus it heavily favors the cube curator and the people who have played the cube a lot. I think it's a really cool idea but definitely clunky in practice in a few ways.
You are spot on. You need multiple morphs in each colour. However, the whole cube has to be morphed (pun intended) around it. If there are 3/3 for two mana, then morph will have a hard time.
Block cubes work great if a morph cube is desired. Also remember that it is hard to mix old and new morph due to the different power levels.
Last tip. In those morph blocks, morph is a sub theme. Only 1 in 7 has morph in onslaught. Which is around 2/7 of the creatures.
I don't really get the hate morphs always get from cubers.
Yes, you need to have more than just a couple to make them work. But it's not like you need Khans of Tatkir ratios. I have 14 in 500 cards and people are never sure what to expect. When they, including me, guess they are very rarely right.
Yes, they do favor people who know the cube (or who are motivated enough to check 'cobra in game), but guess what, that's true, even more so, for counterspells, combat tricks, even instant speed removal.
And yes, it is an issue to have three mana 2/2s in your deck, but only if that's what they are. Glacial Stalker is a three mana 2/2 that can grow later, so that would be tough to make relevant. BUT that is not the relevant question for most morphs. You should rather ask yourself if Phyrexian Rager is playable in your format.
Nantuko Vigilante is a three mana 2/2 that draws you a Naturalize
Silumgar Assassin is a three mana 2/2 that draws you a Vanquish the Weak
Hidden Dragonslayer is a three mana 2/2 that draws you a Legion's Judgment
Fathom Seer is a three mana 2/2 that draws you a Gush
Ire Shaman is a three mana 2/2 that draws you a card.
It's not 100% the same, sure. There are some downsides, like you will loose the card they'd drawn you if the get killed before you can flip them, which means you often won't block the turn you cast them - unless you can trade decently. But there are also upsides, like often getting a better body than a three mana 2/2 once you flipped them and the added flexibility of hardcasting the front side or still being able to cast a three drop when you got color screwed.
Now that I think about it, morphs are probably better in a cube where you don't have many ending up in a deck. If you're just on a couple, you will often be able to choose whether to play a morph or another three drop on turn three, which makes it more likely that you can cast and flip your Fathom Seer or Dragonslayer in the same turn cycle.
Yes, you need to have more than just a couple to make them work. But it's not like you need Khans of Tatkir ratios. I have 14 in 500 cards and people are never sure what to expect. When they, including me, guess they are very rarely right.
Yes, they do favor people who know the cube (or who are motivated enough to check 'cobra in game), but guess what, that's true, even more so, for counterspells, combat tricks, even instant speed removal.
And yes, it is an issue to have three mana 2/2s in your deck, but only if that's what they are. Glacial Stalker is a three mana 2/2 that can grow later, so that would be tough to make relevant. BUT that is not the relevant question for most morphs. You should rather ask yourself if Phyrexian Rager is playable in your format.
Nantuko Vigilante is a three mana 2/2 that draws you a Naturalize
Silumgar Assassin is a three mana 2/2 that draws you a Vanquish the Weak
Hidden Dragonslayer is a three mana 2/2 that draws you a Legion's Judgment
Fathom Seer is a three mana 2/2 that draws you a Gush
Ire Shaman is a three mana 2/2 that draws you a card.
It's not 100% the same, sure. There are some downsides, like you will loose the card they'd drawn you if the get killed before you can flip them, which means you often won't block the turn you cast them - unless you can trade decently. But there are also upsides, like often getting a better body than a three mana 2/2 once you flipped them and the added flexibility of hardcasting the front side or still being able to cast a three drop when you got color screwed.
Now that I think about it, morphs are probably better in a cube where you don't have many ending up in a deck. If you're just on a couple, you will often be able to choose whether to play a morph or another three drop on turn three, which makes it more likely that you can cast and flip your Fathom Seer or Dragonslayer in the same turn cycle.
landofMordor
Administrator
Well, I think it's two or three factors:
1 - the people who have thought about Morph in Cube more than once since 2014 probably have strong thoughts
2 - Magic has gotten significantly more powerful since 2018, so people with strong thoughts on Morph in 2024 are discussing it through this context
(3) - We're only just getting to a place in Cube where power-maxing philosophy is no longer viewed as the default, but even then, power-level discussions probably get more social media traction.
You're not wrong; people haven't discussed Morph favorably recently. But I think that says more about power creep than it does Morph.
This was a really interesting viewpoint, hence my reply. I do think Phyrexian Rager is a B+ kind of card even in 2024 Retail Limited, which is a great prognosis for Morph in cubes of that power level. But on the other hand, Rager is currently Standard-legal and has seen zero play afaik... so it doesn't take much outclass it these days, and that means that Cubes that are even just aiming for "2018-era Standard" as a power level will have a hard time finding a niche for Morphs.
Actually, your point about Nantuko Vigilante "drawing" a Naturalize is a good one, because it also illustrates that killing a Morph with a Shock or whatever is kinda an X-for-1 in the same way that killing a Eidolon of Philosophy is. Morphs are a relatively fragile and high-risk form of card advantage, like Auras or Level-Up or whatever, where a single kill-spell completely halts your progress.
So, I do think it matters that Morphs are Grey Ogres at a baseline. If you just throw random creatures from the last ten years of Magic into a cube, Khans' Morphs gonna be pretty small and high-risk for their cost. (There's ~1,200 Commons printed since 2013 with more than 2 toughness and ~1,300 with 2 toughness or less, so a Morph is only about ~50% to trade in combat with a random Common. Of those trades, only half cost more than
-- in other words, a Morph is out-sized or undercut by nearly 3/4ths of the decade's Commons.) Or, put another way: As Khans Remastered has shown, KTK had to be very careful to make Morphs shine even within its own Limited format -- nerfing Grizzly Bears and removal, putting lots of constraints on mana, and generally slowing down the format.-----
All that said, I hope it's clear that I'm not arguing Morphs are "bad in Cube". To the contrary! I've actually loved Morph gaming, and the stark constrast of Khans Remastered to recent sets like LCI and WOE has illuminated how fun it can be to tango with smaller creatures. It's just made me aware how difficult it is to have good Morph gameplay and 2024 power creep in the same format
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Damn it, now I want to include morph cards in the lower power parts of my cube!
I do not hate morph, au contraire. But my attampt failed by having way too many morphs.
Your cube does a few things:
1) phyrexian rager is playable.
2) Your morph selection is really small, so one who knows your cube could play around them. That said, most of your morphs do not really need playing around as opposed to some of the morphs from onslaught. Most of yours have toughness<=2 when unmorphed. Additionally, your morphs do something when unmorphed as opposed to doing something when they deal damage to a player.