Sets (MKM) Murders at Karlov Manor Previews

[Nanonox]

To be honest, I think this is significantly worse than Satyr Wayfinder. Being able to "draw" a land immediately frees up the creature to enter combat without needing to worry about dying– full value will already have been attained. Plus, Wayfinder mills an extra card, which is really useful for graveyard decks.

The most important part of the Wayfinder for me is the milling. In that department, the Analyst is just as efficient (since one of the cards from the Satyr goes to hand).

So is the body + ability better than a land in hand?
Most of my GY and land decks are on the slow side, trying to recur stuff and gain incremental value. In that context the 1/3 body is a pretty big upgrade over the 1/1 which has minimal value. You do make a good point about risking the Analyst in combat, but it’s just a 2 drop and you’ve gained some value by milling presumably.

Splendid Reclamation is a great GY payoff, but it’s tough to dedicate a slot to it in some cubes. The Analyst does that for the same mana cost! That is an insane ceiling for a 2 drop whose floor is very good too.

I am a big believer that if you want cool things to happen in cube, you have to sow the cards that can let it happen. Here, the cost is so low, that it’s a no brainer for me. If you like more predictable outcomes I can respect the Wayfinder.

I think if you do want to cut something for this card, another piece for the lands deck along the lines of Explore is probably a better pick.

I’m not sure that I want both creatures, but in case I do, this is a solid suggestion.

 

[inscho]

Fair enough. I question the phrasing of Inscho though, all ramp puts the card into play tapped normally.

Yeah, I probably could’ve articulated more clearly

Casting this in turn 3 means you don’t see any extra mana until turn 5 if* you have a land in your graveyard to recur

Draw it later than the third turn and the impact is even less impressive

And I just realized that the trigger targets at the beginning of upkeep so you can’t even sacrifice a land and recur it the same turn. Which mean you can recur a Strip Mine or a single Fetch once every three turns. You’d need multiple lands in the graveyard to be able to recur a land each turn. Just another hurdle to jump through

 

[LadyMapi]

I think the Aftermath Analyst comparison is kinda missing one of the key advantages Satyr Wayfinder has — it's still a pretty reasonable creature even if you aren't playing a deck that wants to throw stuff away. Analyst, on the other hand, is pretty bad if you don't have other pay-offs for stocking your graveyard and/or enough ways to get lands into your graveyard (like, say, a fetch-heavy environment).

 

[Velrun]

When I saw Undergrowth Recon I immediately thought I should think about including a subpar Brokers Hideout that usually would not cut it in Duel Commander.



It will speed up the ramping 3x.

Tagging the mayhaps interested parties: @inscho @Rasmus Källqvist

 

[Onderzeeboot]

That’s a spicy combo Velrun, pretty cool

Add Restore too!

 

[Mown]

I like Divination in red when you're hellbent.

I don't think I'm willing to pay an additional 1 for that upgrade over something like Bitter Reunion though. The upside is there if I wanted to for sure.

I think the various impulse draw effects work better for red than this, but it's a good option.

You should think about it more like a Experimental Frenzy variant, a lategame option to ensure your low-curving red deck doesn't run out of gas. I think it's a solid card, although I don't personally appreciate cards that encourage you to just mindlessly spew all the cards in your hand turn after turn.

You're also going to feel miserable any time the first trigger gives you two lands.

 

[Zoss]

I like Divination in red when you're hellbent.

I don't think I'm willing to pay an additional 1 for that upgrade over something like Bitter Reunion though. The upside is there if I wanted to for sure.

I think the various impulse draw effects work better for red than this, but it's a good option.

As a note, solving is a permanent state change, much more like classes than sagas. This means that this is a Divination every turn, but only after you've emptied your hand, mitigating the usual downside of these "discard everything" effects. Card's nuts. Personally, I think a lot of the Cases are on the pushed side.

As a sidebar, I've always wondered to what extent WotC tries to design mechanics exclusively for limited and exclusively for constructed and how successful they are at hitting their goals on keeping the two separate. It's not the sort of data they'd ever publish, which stinks, but it would be cool to read.

 

[Seeker]

You're also going to feel miserable any time the first trigger gives you two lands.

Yeah, it's gonna feel *really* bad, but when the worst case is "your divination only hit lands" you're in okay shape, right?

 

[Velrun]

Yeah, it's gonna feel *really* bad, but when the worst case is "your divination only hit lands" you're in okay shape, right?

But it’s not really a Divination in that situation then right? You only get 1 card, not 2. However the next few turns after it could be a Divination again.

 

[Nanonox]

think the Aftermath Analyst comparison is kinda missing one of the key advantages Satyr Wayfinder has — it's still a pretty reasonable creature even if you aren't playing a deck that wants to throw stuff away.

How often does that happen though?

This might be me being too focused on my own environments, but with the amount of playables you get in a draft, I have a tough time believing this would even matter. If you don't care about the GY, you probably just play another 2 drop that is more synergistic with your strategy or a cheaper cantrip to smooth draws.
Maybe Deeproot Wayfinder is a better comparaison and card to replace, but I don’t run that.

What has me so excited is that the Analyst is a GY payoff AND enabler on a perfectly reasonable body and at a competitive rate (both mana value and cost to activate).

 

[MilesOfficial]

How often does that happen though?

Yeah, I agree. I didn't see my players grabbing Satyr Wayfinder unless they were doing the graveyard deck, but it also didn't get them thinking about the graveyard deck because it just seemed like an anemic value engine to them. Aftermath Analyst is shouting from the heavens "please flood your graveyard" and that's really helpful to me in a 720 list with so many different available archetypes.

It doesn't need to be "better" if it suits the role in Cube more appropriately, IMO.

You should think about it more like a Experimental Frenzy variant, a lategame option to ensure your low-curving red deck doesn't run out of gas. I think it's a solid card, although I don't personally appreciate cards that encourage you to just mindlessly spew all the cards in your hand turn after turn.

That's a good point, but also, I do like the cards that encourage you to drop your hand. Anything that encourages different play-patterns or deck construction is worth a look IMO. I mean, I've been running Moonveil Regent since Midnight Hunt and it accomplishes some of the same thing...while being attached to a 4/4 dragon. I think it's more interesting overall.



EDIT - ON ANOTHER NOTE:



Hooray for surprise continuations of cycles! I love the Hunted Bonebrute. I am 90% sure to not going to include it, because there haven't been any other Disguise cards I've been interested in, and because it doesn't have reminder text. But I like both modes of it quite a bit, and think it's fun. Power level is middling but acceptable. Needing yet another token type....eh.



I love this card's function but it's also a mana rock that will make players' eyes glaze over with all the text. Can't justify it.

 

[ravnic]

View attachment 9199
I was just making cuts to slot in Splendid Reclamation and they reveal this! Great body for slower deck, good set up piece for GY decks and the rate on the ability is what you would expect and unconditional!

Slamming this, good bye Satyr Wayfinder

I am also testing this, most likely. It's another piece for the loam deck I am trying to make a real thing between dredge and lanfall. However, I am going to cut Grappel with the Past instead. Most Gx graveyard decks probably want the permanent, that can block, rather than the spell.

You can sac an artifact/discard a card to draw and give it +2/+0 when it attacks.

I wish this was in black instead, I'd like both better discard outlets and more artifact payoffs in that color, red I already have a decent amount of it.

This card is perfectly tailored for my cube. But I am not going to add it.

There are just many different aspects I dislike here, all flavor-related. First, 0/3 is just a weird stat line for a little, reckless (dare)devil.

Second, a general concern I have with this set is, that now suddenly everyone and everything on ravnica seems to be a dectective. It's worse than in Detective Conan. Not only characters well known for being something very different, like Lazav, are now called detectives, also any living being, like this devil (a species usually shown as fiends interested in pranks and torture) or even a gargoyle are depicted with a stereotypical detective hat. It just feels not authentic at all. Unbelieveable. It's like a gimmick party is happenig on ravnica right now. "Un-intentionally funny" would've been another option for this set's name.

 

[Aston]

Second, a general concern I have with this set is, that now suddenly everyone and everything on ravnica seems to be a dectective. It's worse than in Detective Conan. Not only characters well known for being something very different, like Lazav, are now called detectives, also any living being, like this devil (a species usually shown as fiends interested in pranks and torture) or even a gargoyle are depicted with a stereotypical detective hat. It just feels not authentic at all. Unbelieveable. It's like a gimmick party is happenig on ravnica right now. "Un-intentionally funny" would've been another option for this set's name.

I definitely felt this as well while looking the previews, you're spot on with the lack of authenticity. It's like anyone can call themselves a detective.

 

[LadyMapi]

Yeah, the aesthetic and vibe feels really off for Ravnica. It feels pretty obvious that this set was originally supposed to take place on a brand new plane, though I'm confused about why they went for Ravnica when New Capenna is right over there being the Magical Mobster Plane.

But nope! Now we have mole people on Ravnica and there's apparently space for a well-funded independent detective agency despite the Azorius and Boros still being more-or-less in one piece? Also, uh... one of the Guilds that was wrecked by the invasion are the guys who grow all of the food — you'd think that that'd be a bigger deal...

 

[TrainmasterGT]

Honestly, I'm less worried about the fact that it "doesn't feel like Ravnica" (it feels like Ravnica with some noir wallpaper over it for whatever reason) and more about the fact that most of the cards are pretty mediocre.

 

[Seeker]

Now we have mole people on Ravnica

the merfolk came from a giant underground sinkhole, the mole people probably came from a giant cave that for some reason nobody had ever set foot in before

 

[Velrun]

Yeah, the aesthetic and vibe feels really off for Ravnica. It feels pretty obvious that this set was originally supposed to take place on a brand new plane, though I'm confused about why they went for Ravnica when New Capenna is right over there being the Magical Mobster Plane.

But nope! Now we have mole people on Ravnica and there's apparently space for a well-funded independent detective agency despite the Azorius and Boros still being more-or-less in one piece? Also, uh... one of the Guilds that was wrecked by the invasion are the guys who grow all of the food — you'd think that that'd be a bigger deal...

They explained that pretty damn well in the Debut Video.

In my poor retelling it’s something like they need to have a law for there to be a crime and there needs to be stakes (are they killing my favorite character) for there to be interest in the murder mystery.

 

[LadyMapi]

The thing is that "someone just went and got murdered" doesn't really need a law to justify why people would be interested in finding out whodunnit. And if you really need a place with laws, the plane where the legal code is both sentient and arguably one of the local laws of nature is probably overkill. And then they went ahead and had one of the attempted murders be Aurelia, aka the local equivalent of the police commissioner... which is problematic, because the basic structure of this kind of plot needs a reason why no one just calls the cops.

It all just ends up feeling really forced to me. Like, they made it more-or-less work, but out of all of the options they had for "plane with fan-favorite characters where you could reasonably set a whodunnit", they went for the hard one.

...

In any case:

Forensic Toolsmith —
Creature — Vedalken Artificer Detective
Whenever you cast an artifact spell, Investigate.
Activated abilities of artifacts you control cost less to activate. This can't reduce the cost below one mana.
2/3

Seems pretty alright.

 

[Velrun]

I am not saying I disagree with either you or Ravnic Nor that I agree with MARO. I actually feel like I am also one of those players who focus more on the big picture like flavor, planes, art style, overall card design etc than mere individual card power level so I can fully sympathize with this standpoint with too many detectives on Ravnica.

 

[Zoss]

Not to be too down on the subject, but I've also had a hard time with detectives on Ravnica, and I think it's because they feel so anachronistic. A lot of the tropes of detectives come from stories written in the late 19th and early-to-mid 20th century, arguably starting with Sherlock Homes' first appearance in 1887 (yes, Poe and others wrote about mystery-solvers earlier, but Homes defined the genre. And yes, it's Holmes who defined it, not Arthur Conan Doyle; how many authors have been bullied into bringing back a deceased character?) Ravnica, at least when it was first introduced, was depicted as a city of hardscrabble medieval guilds. There's no technology outside of individual wizards' towers, and most people are struggling to get by. They've certainly evolved past that with subsequent sets, but the point stands that detectives require subtle crimes to solve, and most of the crimes as defined by Ravnican law are caused by the Gruul and the Rakdos, neither of whom are subtle. (From our point of view, all the guilds commit crimes, but the Orzhov are careful to note that everything they do is considered perfectly legal! The misdeeds of the guilds are typically not crimes but rather are political offenses to other guilds.)

But we don't have to look that far to see that this is not the Ravnica we know and love. Even the trappings of detectivism (The idea of forensics! The magnifying glasses! The cameras! The silly little hats!) clash with the art style built up on this world. And the art doesn't stop at Marlowe and Marple. Look at Aftermath Analyst--that image is straight out of Shadowrun, the superior cyberpunk ttrpg (fite me).

There's an in-world justification for all this, but frankly it's ass.

Anyways, I like the ideas in the set, I just don't think that I'll use any of the new named mechanics. Looks like it'll be fun to draft, though!

 

[Seeker]

I will say that magnifying glasses are super Ravnica even all the way back.



This fine specimen absolutely owns like, seven magnifying glasses for different sizes of weird magic electricity that he's staring intently at for "research" that terrifies his neighbors.

 

[Onderzeeboot]

Not to be too down on the subject, but I've also had a hard time with detectives on Ravnica, and I think it's because they feel so anachronistic. A lot of the tropes of detectives come from stories written in the late 19th and early-to-mid 20th century, arguably starting with Sherlock Homes' first appearance in 1887. Ravnica, at least when it was first introduced, was depicted as a city of hardscrabble medieval guilds. There's no technology outside of individual wizards' towers, and most people are struggling to get by. They've certainly evolved past that with subsequent sets, but the point stands that even the trappings of detectivism (The idea of forensics! The magnifying glasses! The cameras! The silly little hats!) clash with the art style built up on this world.

Anyways, I like the ideas in the set, I just don't think that I'll use any of the new named mechanics. Looks like it'll be fun to draft, though!

I mean, this set is a continuation of those recent sets, so I don't think you can look at original Ravnica. But even original Ravnica had cards like Bronze Bombshell, Junktroller, Evolution Vat, and Gruul War Plow, which definitely are outside of the scope of a medieval setting. For me Ravnica is a huge plane-wide steam engine era city with access to magic, which makes it perfect for detectives. Not that I'm necessarily a fan, because detectives don't really feel like Magic the Gathering, regardless of whether they fit on Ravnica, and the density is quite high.

 

[StrionicAdventurer]

I'm also a little put off by the sheer density of detectivework in this set from a flavor perspective, but I feel better about it when I compare it to Crimson Vow. That set had a really enjoyable flavor, because the stakes of the story were a lot more reasonable than "existential threat to sapient life throughout the multiverse." Not everyone on Innistrad was invited to the wedding, but everyone knew it was happening, and it was the main event in the story.

That having been said, the fedoras are a little too much.



The art on this card simply doesn't take place on Ravnica. I know it's a big plane, but we've been here so many times and people just don't dress like this. It would make complete sense on New Capenna (or even Arcavios), and honestly I like the art. But it doesn't fit the established world of Ravnica at all.

What's so crazy about this is that the very first Ravnica set is a murder mystery! Agrus Kos was a hardboiled cop protagonist whose whole story is basically "what if a Dashiell Hammett novel took place in a pan-European cityscape?" You're telling me there were no fedoras on Ravnica while Agrus was trying to unravel the conspiracy against Mat'Selesnya's life, but now, a few years later, you have to wear a fedora to investigate a crime?

 

[Velrun]

Yep the art direction is super strange. They have been pretty consistent with what planes have what art. But not here.

Maybe they started on another plane and very late changed it to Ravnica after most arts were completed and paid for.

 

[LadyMapi]

how many authors have been bullied into bringing back a deceased character?

You'd be surprised. One of my favorite examples is Pinocchio, of all characters.

...

I'll admit, the hats are big part of the reason why my gut says New Capenna would have been a better choice...

As for the "are there magnifying glasses on Ravnica?" thing... Magic's brand has always been a mix of standard high fantasy stuff + magitech, so it's not super jarring to me (though everyone and their mother having them is... odd?)... but the fashion and the de-emphasis of the aftermath of the invasion (which killed two guilds, including the guys who grow the food) feel off to me, especially since this set is supposed to take place, like, a year after -Day.

...

Also, I just checked the timeline, and hoo boy.

• Chandra accidentally unleashes the Eldrazi titans in 4557 AR, the Gatewatch "kill" Kozilek and Ulamog in 4559, with Emrakul taking her vacation in Innistrad's moon later that year (they then have to fix the moon two years later, because Emrakul).
• Nicol Bolas's big Amonkhet-y plans starts around 4500 AR, then the Hour of Devastation and ensuing invasion of Ravnica happen in 4560.
• New Phyrexia starts being a thing around 4400 AR (that's around when Glissa got compleated), actively takes over Mirrodin in the 4550s (Karn gets rescued in 4557), starts its extraplanar scouting missions in 4561, then invades everywhere in 4562.

Suddenly the fact that the detective agency is only a year old (Magic's present day is currently 4563 AR, and it was explicitly founded after the invasion) seems less important than the fact that every single important event in the last decade or so of sets has taken place over five in-game years. Maybe a time-skip is in order?

EDIT: The big events of Agrus Kos's life/unlife happened over the course of, like, 4483 AR to 4495 AR (what's that? a storyline that takes place over more than two years? I'm shocked!), so it has been almost 70 years... maybe the Azorius declared a new "trenchcoat and fedora" uniform for detectives when we weren't looking?