Onderzeeboot's Khans of Alara WUBGR Cube

[Onderzeeboot]

All right, I am finally dipping my toes into the one part of this forum I avoided so far out of fear it would suck me in and consume all of my time. But, I need help, so I have no choice. Here I am.

Link
Because my cube uses a lot of custom cards, it sadly isn't possible to host it on cubetutor.com. I have instead made a blog where you can watch the visual spoiler. Although it has reached the full 450 cards, is a cube ever truly finished? Ideas are still welcome and will be taken into consideration

Fuck yeah! CubeTutor now has the ability to host custom images, so my cube is draftable on CubeTutor!

Edit: Apparently not. I've given this cube a rest for a month, and didn't really like what I saw when I came back. Azorius and Esper were just not doing it, and I had left out Grixis and Abzan, the two shards I was most exited with in my old cube. So, a redo is in order. The tenets of the cube haven't changed, but the color wheel has, so a rebuild is in order! The rebuild is finished

Visual spoiler

Quick Stats:
450 cards
Unpowered
All Rareties
Multicolor environment
Shifted color wheel
Duplicates
Custom Cards
Utility Land Draft

Guilds & Shards & Wedges Oh My
My cube is based on this article by Jason. I tried out a few configurations that didn't entirely satisfy me, and recently eventually settled on . All the allied color pairs and the corresponding color triplets are there. For example, Boros () and Izzet () combine to form Jeskai (). I will refer to these color-triplets as shards in the rest of my posts here, because they will consist of allied color pairs according to my redefined color wheel. Jeskai, you're a shard now! The full list is as follows:

(Boros)
(Izzet)
(Dimir)
(Golgari)
(Selesnya)

(Jeskai)
(Grixis)
(Sultai)
(Abzan)
(Naya)

A more comprehensive list of features can be found in the posts below.

Edit: Due to my audible to another color wheel, I'll have to pretty much figure everything out from scratch again. These posts will probably not be complete for a while.

 

[Onderzeeboot]

Shard Identities
Below (and in the next post) you'll find a short write-up for each shard, together with the actual 3-color cards I am going to include. That should give a decent idea of where each shard is heading, making it easier to suggest cards etc. Of course it's also plain fun to show of awesome customs

Edit: Because I changed the color wheel, this writeup won't be entirely accurate for a while.

- Jeskai
A color that can aggro it out pretty well, using a tempo/prowess shell.

This color combination should also be able to play a convincing controling role.

Spoiler: Jeskai cards

- Grixis
Classic control.

Spoiler: Grixis cards

 

[Onderzeeboot]

- Sultai
This color combination is more of a grindy midrange/control shard, with a lot of graveyard recursion. Dimir and Golgari both have a lot of enablers for this strategy, as well as pay-off cards.

This color combination also houses the resident zombie theme. There are a surprising amount of cubeable zombies that intersect nicely into other strategies. Blue also has a few decent roleplayers, and if you put the three colors together you should be able to build a decent tribal deck.

Spoiler: Sultai cards

- Abzan
Abzan is the color combination with the most answers. There aren't a lot of board states that can't be solved by Abzan removal. Abzan runs a small constellation theme, partly on the back of custom cards. There's not too many constellation cards in the cube, but the effects tend to snowball into a nice little card/tempo advantage engine. Apart from that the color also is pretty good at reanimating stuff and going to value-town.

Spoiler: Abzan cards

 

[Onderzeeboot]

- Naya
Naya likes playing it wide. All three colors have cards that put multiple creatures on the battlefield, and cards that pump the whole team or make having a lot of (expendable) bodies a boon. Alternatively, you can also go big, using green's ramp, white's walls, red's spot removal, and the big fatties in the colors. It's pretty much the go-to color for those just wanting to beat down in cube.

Spoiler: Naya cards

Spoiler: Old hijacked post

So, is a thing in this cube, except the cards suck really hard apart from:



For cube purposes, almost all of the other options are horribly inefficient. I mean, I guess Sultai Soothsayer isn't as insulting as Kheru Lich Lord, but it's not going to draw me into the color combination. I want cards that make me want to play the color, and since I want to run a cube with a focus on the three-color pairs, I want more than three cards to do so. Now there's the fuse spells I'm working on, but I also thought of two other spells. So, I need some feedback on these ideas.

Question: Do these cards make you want to play ?



Edit: Updated images based on comments below!
Edit2: Reminder text added to remind players Speaker of the Dead loses shroud when it copies another creature.

 

[Eric Chan]

Is Mimeoplasm an option? As reanimation on spells go, he's pretty good value for five mana, and fits into the graveyard theme I'm assuming you'll have.

While Sultai Charm is efficient and versatile, I actually think Sultai Ascendancy is a better build-around, and signals the supported theme more strongly to your drafters.

 

[Grillo_Parlante]

The card that most makes me want to draft BUG is:



Being able to tutor for a key combo piece before self-milling begins, and rig your next draws for self-mill is really powerful. You can setup normal reanimation, mass reanimation, and add consistancy to self-mill effects.

This can result in some big exciting plays with cards like living death, empty the pits, kessig cagebreakers, laboratory maniac, splinterfright, mindshrieker or ghoultree.

 

[shamizy]

The fuse spell should be named Crime//Punishment. Make it work somehow flavorwise w/the art, maybe just some raise dead type picture (necromancy is wrong yo).

Tomb Raiding is a sweet idea for a card and I also like the split card, but not really feeling the Speaker of the Dead. It just doesn't seem all that interesting to me, not much of a draw there. Hybrid activated abilities ala Tasigur or some costs could be interesting to work with when it comes to your wedge cards. Probably just need better guild cards and enablers to push you towards a given archetype. Your cube is obviously pushing towards wedges, but you'll need some archetype enablers in single color as well to fuel certain gameplans. Maybe some of these?



As far as guild cards are concerned, since you're pushing certain wedges, I'd look to put in more cards that would be fought over by two different wedges. I definitely see a lot of enabler type cards, but not very many that would make me really consider which wedge I'd want to go into. You want more cards that can fit into decks A and B rather than single deck enablers like Siren of the Silent Song which has one apparent home. A card like Feeling of Dread can pull double duty in Esper builds as a means to buy time, but can also be a means of pushing through the last points of damage + prowess triggers in a Jeskai Aggro build.

 

[Onderzeeboot]

Yeah, Mimeoplasm is alright. I don't know if he actually draws people into the color, but I was considering him for the seventh slot. The other option is Abomination of Gudul, which is actually pretty decent at both attacking and enabling.

Sultai Ascendancy doesn't really excite me. It may be a good signal for the graveyard theme Sultai is indeed bound to have, but apart from that it looks like a pretty bad card. It probably plays better than it looks because it fixes your draws though. Got any experience with the card?

 

[Eric Chan]

I don't, and I agree it's pretty weak - Crystal Ball is no one's idea of a cubeable card, and the much-harder-to-cast Ascendancy is only marginally better. On second thought, probably any graveyard filler is better, i.e. Grisly Salvage.

 

[Onderzeeboot]

The card that most makes me want to draft BUG is:



Being able to tutor for a key combo piece before self-milling begins, and rig your next draws for self-mill is really powerful. You can setup normal reanimation, mass reanimation, and add consistancy to self-mill effects.

This can result in some big exciting plays with cards like living death, empty the pits, kessig cagebreakers, laboratory maniac, splinterfright, mindshrieker or ghoultree.

I like the gist of these suggestions. I don't want Empty the Pits for its restrictive mana cost, or Laboratory Maniac for it's specificity on top of a weak body, but the idea is sound.

The fuse spell should be named Crime//Punishment. Make it work somehow flavorwise w/the art, maybe just some raise dead type picture (necromancy is wrong yo).

Tomb Raiding is a sweet idea for a card and I also like the split card, but not really feeling the Speaker of the Dead. It just doesn't seem all that interesting to me, not much of a draw there. Hybrid activated abilities ala Tasigur or some costs could be interesting to work with when it comes to your wedge cards. Probably just need better guild cards and enablers to push you towards a given archetype. Your cube is obviously pushing towards wedges, but you'll need some archetype enablers in single color as well to fuel certain gameplans. Maybe some of these?



As far as guild cards are concerned, since you're pushing certain wedges, I'd look to put in more cards that would be fought over by two different wedges. I definitely see a lot of enabler type cards, but not very many that would make me really consider which wedge I'd want to go into. You want more cards that can fit into decks A and B rather than single deck enablers like Siren of the Silent Song which has one apparent home. A card like Feeling of Dread can pull double duty in Esper builds as a means to buy time, but can also be a means of pushing through the last points of damage + prowess triggers in a Jeskai Aggro build.

Crime // Punishment already exists (in fact, it's the card I ripped the Punishment half off), but in my most recent batch my split card is called Up // Down.

Your point for cross-over cards is really good. I definitely need to keep that in mind! Feeling of Dread is a very good suggestion.

Help me make Speaker of the Dead more interesting. I love the concept, and it feels very to me, so I am interested in making it... well... interesting!

 

[Onderzeeboot]

Help me make Speaker of the Dead more interesting. I love the concept, and it feels very to me, so I am interested in making it... well... interesting!

How about

At the beginning of your upkeep, you may exile target creature card from a graveyard. If you do, put a +1/+1 counter on ~ and it becomes a copy of that card until end of turn.

 

[Grillo_Parlante]

I really like the flavor of the original card; and honestly, i.m.o its probably fine as is. There are a lot of really sweet interactions with it, and if its just a question of making it look more spicy to attract drafters, you might be able to do it with a simple keyword ability: shroud, flying, or trample.

 

[shamizy]

How about

At the beginning of your upkeep, you may exile target creature card from a graveyard. If you do, put a +1/+1 counter on ~ and it becomes a copy of that card until end of turn.

I think the problem with the Speaker is the wedge color commitment. For that cost, I want something that really wows me since I can't bank on playing it on curve every time. Personally I think wedge cards should be more archetype defining or have some really high payoff for casting. A clone that gets bigger and is conditional on other cards isn't as impressive to me. I just don't find clones that interesting unless there's something cool (like Dack's Duplicate). Counters are pretty meh to me unless it's actually relevant to enable other cards. Maybe if he had a relevant body and performed his copying effect in a different way.

How about:

A the beginning of your upkeep, you may exile target creature card from a graveyard. If you do, Speaker of the Dead gains +X/+0 until end of turn where X is the exiled creature's converted mana cost.

Need to give him a more interesting body, maybe a 2/4 or a 1/5 with a keyword, can then justify bumping up the mana cost by 1 or 2. I feel like most Sultai decks are defensive, and having a body that can chump for a bit, buy time to fill up the grave, would be cool. Also flavorful by kinda channeling dead creatures and whatnot.

 

[Onderzeeboot]

Well, to each his own it seems

Need to give him a more interesting body, maybe a 2/4 or a 1/5 with a keyword, can then justify bumping up the mana cost by 1 or 2. I feel like most Sultai decks are defensive, and having a body that can chump for a bit, buy time to fill up the grave, would be cool. Also flavorful by kinda channeling dead creatures and whatnot.

The problem is I don't want it to be more expensive. This is supposed to be the Mantis Rider, Woolly Thoctar or Sprouting Thrinax in Sultai colors. It should be just efficient enough to draw you into those colors. Maybe not as a first pick, but if you are already in two of the colors, it should be tempting to branch out.

Maybe the abilities just don't do that for you, but I'm planning on enough interactions that both are fun to play around with. There will be a +1/+1 counter theme, pretty much throughout the colors. Good on-color examples would be Thrummingbird, Corpsejack and Cytoplast Root-Kin. The conditional clone part interacts nicely with your removal and stuff like Smokestack and Birthing Pod.

I think I will make the base body a 2/4 shroud then. You are right that at 3/3 it doesn't really offer what Sultai is looking for. At the new stats it defends better in the early game, and your opponent won't be able to touch it before the first transformation.

Thanks for the insights both!

My second suggestion also steers it too close to The Mimeoplasm, so that's probably a bad idea anyway.

 

[Rasmus Källqvist]

Maybe you could word it like "as long as ~ doesn't have a +1/+1 counter on it, it has shroud" just for clarity? Otherwise, I like the initiative to complete cycles and fill in holes wotc hasn't.

 

[Onderzeeboot]

Maybe you could word it like "as long as ~ doesn't have a +1/+1 counter on it, it has shroud" just for clarity? Otherwise, I like the initiative to complete cycles and fill in holes wotc hasn't.

That takes up so many text though, it's probably fine as is. Just got to RTFC

In other words, taking a cue from Planeshift (battlemages), Alara Reborn (Slave of Bolas and friends), Dragon's Maze (fuse rares), and Fates Reforged (khans), I want to add more shard cards that can be played in a 2-color deck. Still working on a few of these, but I am super, super pumped to add these:



I think these are balanced, though Jeskai Brave looks nuts, but feel free to shoot (or get as excited as I am). The idea is making the base body of the battlemages (Stormscape Battlemage and friends) playable in limited by adding a keyword. In some cases this makes for very fun interactions with the kicker abilities a well. Man, I really can't wait to recur Jeskai Brave. One of those kicker costs should probably go up though, five mana seems a bit cheap for a recurring Lifegain Shock...

Edit: Jeskai Brave updated.

 

[Alfonzo Bonzo]

Jeskai brave seems a bit nuts, mini helix with buyback?

Re sultai cards, how about

 

[Alfonzo Bonzo]

You could always make jeskai brave target other creature for the blue kicker?

 

[Onderzeeboot]

Re sultai cards, how about Vorosh, the Hunter

He's just a big dumb beater. I don't find him very inspiring to be honest. He's sure to be decent, but I don't think he adds a lot of play to a game of Magic.

You could always make jeskai brave target other creature for the blue kicker?

Yeah, I thought about that. Maybe I just ignore my itch to create a loop. How fun is recurring the same creature over and over again? Okay, when I put it like that... Changing it now

I also got the next batch ready. These are the "khans". These are a lot more freeform, so there's more room to tweak. Again, trying to create interesting interactions here. These should be pretty powerful in a draft, but not unbeatable.



PS. Please keep commenting on the Braves as well if you got any input!

Edit: Yansi updated based on feedback. Card is way less wordy now (though still blue and thus wordy ).

 

[Onderzeeboot]

I updated Speaker of the Dead with a reminder text for shroud, and simplified Yansi. Thanks for the feedback guys.

The Slave of Bolas project turned into a spell and four creatures. I decided against reusing Thopter Foundry, since it's either ridiculous (Sword of the Meek, artifact lands) or very poisonous (who wants to sacrifice an artifact). I do like the effect though, so it makes kind of a return here. The others are completely new by necessity. I don't believe there are cards with those mana costs (regardless of the colorless component). Feedback is welcome, as always.



Edit: Changed wording on Victual Chains slightly to make it easier to parse.

 

[Chris Taylor]

I think Victual Chains would make more sense as (IE: Red/White and Red/Blue rather than Blue/White and Red/White) instead of than in it's current form. Mandating Red Mana for a threaten makes more sense to me than giving blue white that effect, especially at sorcery. Ray of Command existed because control magic did, despite playing entirely differently most times

 

[Onderzeeboot]

I think Victual Chains would make more sense as (IE: Red/White and Red/Blue rather than Blue/White and Red/White) instead of than in it's current form. Mandating Red Mana for a threaten makes more sense to me than giving blue white that effect, especially at sorcery. Ray of Command existed because control magic did, despite playing entirely differently most times

Well, the colored part of those casting costs is locked in, so I can't do . Each of the cards costs a color plus it's two allied colors as the hybrid pair (plus an optional amount of colorless mana of course). In this cube, red and blue are allied colors to white. The lifelink would make less sense at than the Threaten effect does at as well. Anyway, for this card I need an effect that is shared by and . I already covered the P/T switch on the white legend, which pretty much leaves me with either Threaten or draw/discard. Since the original inspiration for this cycle was Slave of Bolas, because Threaten effects are always a welcome addition to any cube, and because it fits the tempo feel of the shard exceptionally well, I chose to go with a Threaten variant.

I realize it's not an effect usually done in blue, but on hybrid cards I feel it's fair game (see also Dominus of Fealty).

Does no one have any power level issues with any of these cards?

 

[Alfonzo Bonzo]

Victual chains is very wordy, I wonder if there's any way to make it more elegant?
Thopter carrier is fine, doesn't seem very exciting but depends on the other synergies in the cube.
Necrophidian is great, I wonder if it should have one toughness, but depends on removal in cube. I like it.
I think murderous mystic is underpowered. Haha, missed draw a card, it's good.
Earthmote adept is... Odd. But I think it's fine.

 

[Onderzeeboot]

Victual chains is very wordy, I wonder if there's any way to make it more elegant?
Thopter carrier is fine, doesn't seem very exciting but depends on the other synergies in the cube.
Necrophidian is great, I wonder if it should have one toughness, but depends on removal in cube. I like it.
I think murderous mystic is underpowered. Haha, missed draw a card, it's good.
Earthmote adept is... Odd. But I think it's fine.

Yeah, I liked the old templating better. See Threaten. The wording on modern-day threaten effects, like Act of Treason, looks a bit choppy. Add the tap, doesn't untap step, and you've got a wordy card. Only other wording change I can think of is rewriting the last part a la Ray of Command, i.e. "When you lose control of the creature, tap it. It doesn't untap during its controller's next untap step." That might actually be preferable, it looks like it's easier to parse what happens when that way. I'll put it up in a moment, so you can see if it reads better yourself.

I think it's funny you like Thopter Carrier the least. That might be my favorite one. (Well, almost, Necrophidian is the most awesomest of course!) I dig the tiny incremental advantage it provides. Cracking a Executioner's Capsule with this in play is so sweet!

Earthmote Adept is odd indeed. I was looking for a way to add a mechanic to the card, without using lifegain. Again. Actually, the legend also manages to avoid lifegain. I'm pretty pleased Anyway, next I was looking for a red ability other than haste or first strike. Again. I thought the landfall trigger was pretty cute with the land tutor part. I want to search for a fetchland soon

Last but not least, thanks for the positive feedback.

 

[Onderzeeboot]

Ok, I think I need to redesign these two.

Esper has more than enough creatures and doesn't really want more. I think I'll make him into a legendary artifact instead. I have some ideas...

Zotan seems too brutal. Sure, he might whack yourself once, but how is your opponent going to defend against him? If he plays a blocker it will get tapped, and whack him for good measure as well.

I'm also starting to fill up the second post with the cards I am planning on putting in each shard. Thanks to the various "not really three color"-cards I can stuff a lot more in this section.