I feel like I tried this at one point, but I couldn't find it in my cut cards mse file. My guess is that its probably pretty good, but naturally limited by the power of the spells you're getting to flashback (and its color).
General Print this Wizards! (So I can put it in my cube)
- Thread starter Chris Taylor
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I feel like I tried this at one point, but I couldn't find it in my cut cards mse file. My guess is that its probably pretty good, but naturally limited by the power of the spells you're getting to flashback (and its color).
Chris Taylor
Contributor
So I've been trying to design a white brainstorm (IE Something cheap to increase the chances white drafters have the spells they need at the right time)
Having something in your environment like this really helps mana flood/screw, as well as letting niche cards be a little more consistent, since (in brainstorm's case specifically, but more generally with scry, for example) you can get rid of narrow cards like Wrath of God (Sometimes the best card in your deck, sometimes the worst) and dig towards something relavant.
It's nice enough that I don't think it's something that should be constrained to blue, and my experience with limited formats that contain cycling, scry, and lots of modal spells are great examples.
I've already got green and red cards that fill the same void while giving nods to that color's archetypes, all while feeling like a (Strong) card that could be printed in that color:
and blue has brainstorm.
Black doesn't quite have something in my cube yet, but it has lots of things to generally sink mana into anyways, and has actual card draw of it's own, which basically doesn't exist in white, but who knows, maybe I'll triple up on demonic tutor at some point
Anyways, the issue is that making card draw feel white is really hard. The closest thing I've got for thematic white card draw is mentor of the meek, (which is still mostly green anyways), but that doesn't really help general white consistency since it only works when you're winning.
Alright sure, something that hasn't been done yet, but still feels white. I'll give it a shot, not like it'd be the first time I shat on the color pie for gameplay reasons
Anyways, how does this look?
Sadly Reconnaissance is already a card, or I'd use that (It's actually a decent one too, gives all your creatures vigilance since you can activate it during the end of combat step)
It could also say draw then scry 1, but A) I wanted to distance this from serum visions, and B) I think investigate fits nicely with the "giving you info you'll use later" feel of the card.
Spying is blue, and scouting is green, but this is somewhere in between, and the people doing the scouting are commonly white
Having something in your environment like this really helps mana flood/screw, as well as letting niche cards be a little more consistent, since (in brainstorm's case specifically, but more generally with scry, for example) you can get rid of narrow cards like Wrath of God (Sometimes the best card in your deck, sometimes the worst) and dig towards something relavant.
It's nice enough that I don't think it's something that should be constrained to blue, and my experience with limited formats that contain cycling, scry, and lots of modal spells are great examples.
I've already got green and red cards that fill the same void while giving nods to that color's archetypes, all while feeling like a (Strong) card that could be printed in that color:
and blue has brainstorm.
Black doesn't quite have something in my cube yet, but it has lots of things to generally sink mana into anyways, and has actual card draw of it's own, which basically doesn't exist in white, but who knows, maybe I'll triple up on demonic tutor at some point
Anyways, the issue is that making card draw feel white is really hard. The closest thing I've got for thematic white card draw is mentor of the meek, (which is still mostly green anyways), but that doesn't really help general white consistency since it only works when you're winning.
Alright sure, something that hasn't been done yet, but still feels white. I'll give it a shot, not like it'd be the first time I shat on the color pie for gameplay reasons
Anyways, how does this look?
Sadly Reconnaissance is already a card, or I'd use that (It's actually a decent one too, gives all your creatures vigilance since you can activate it during the end of combat step)
It could also say draw then scry 1, but A) I wanted to distance this from serum visions, and B) I think investigate fits nicely with the "giving you info you'll use later" feel of the card.
Spying is blue, and scouting is green, but this is somewhere in between, and the people doing the scouting are commonly white
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
Hey! You actually ended up using the Brawl mechanic! How does it play?Alright sure, something that hasn't been done yet, but still feels white. I'll give it a shot, not like it'd be the first time I shat on the color pie for gameplay reasons
It's not bad, but not really exciting or powerful either? You could just use Bygone Bishop's or Mentor of the Meek's text on a
enchantment? Something along the lines of Tithe or Land Tax would also be a nod towards old school 1 cmc white card advantage engines.
Chris Taylor
Contributor
mentor of the meek enchantment doesn't help unless you have creatures in hand, so I'm looking for something a little more one and done. Tithe is close, but only finding lands means I wouldn't play it in aggro.
Brawl has been great! It's just on that single card, but that card has been good (Though I've changed it to support 1. The wording in that image means you can't cast it if your board is empty)
Brawl has been great! It's just on that single card, but that card has been good (Though I've changed it to support 1. The wording in that image means you can't cast it if your board is empty)
White brainstorm ideas from accidentally dreaming on it:
Reveal top 2 cards of library, and either put them on the bottom of your library or exchange them for cards with the same CMC from your hand (these go to the top). W instant.
Look at the bottom 3 cards of your library and exchange 2 of them with 2 cards from your hand (put the third in yr yard??)
Scry 1, fateseal 1, investigate is the sweet spot imo but it might want to be a sorcery instead
Telling Time but it's a Sorcery for
Investigate for each card target opponent has in hand more than you do (op maybe)
Reveal top 2 cards of library, and either put them on the bottom of your library or exchange them for cards with the same CMC from your hand (these go to the top). W instant.
Look at the bottom 3 cards of your library and exchange 2 of them with 2 cards from your hand (put the third in yr yard??)
Scry 1, fateseal 1, investigate is the sweet spot imo but it might want to be a sorcery instead
Telling Time but it's a Sorcery for
Investigate for each card target opponent has in hand more than you do (op maybe)
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
How about these?
Edit: Alternatively, better stats in exchange for information.
Could be a blue card too, I guess, but is funny in white, plus white stats and all information out in the open, because white likes to play "fair"
Edit2: Oh look, I found an even cooler wording for the effect!
Edit: Alternatively, better stats in exchange for information.
Could be a blue card too, I guess, but is funny in white, plus white stats and all information out in the open, because white likes to play "fair"
Edit2: Oh look, I found an even cooler wording for the effect!
Chris Taylor
Contributor
So I think I've stumbled on an answer to the white brainstorm question
I mean it feels white (Bargaining), but in a way that's good enough to be playable, since you do always get what you want. What do you guys think?
Also, on an unrelated note, which of these do you like better?
It's this kinda weird living weapon, recurring nightmare, blood pet meets woebearer mashup?
I mean it feels white (Bargaining), but in a way that's good enough to be playable, since you do always get what you want. What do you guys think?
Also, on an unrelated note, which of these do you like better?
It's this kinda weird living weapon, recurring nightmare, blood pet meets woebearer mashup?
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
So I think I've stumbled on an answer to the white brainstorm question
View attachment 1042
I mean it feels white (Bargaining), but in a way that's good enough to be playable, since you do always get what you want. What do you guys think?
To be honest (
) I think it's a more powerful and less interesting variant on my Court Machinations card one post above. Because it's an instant, your opponent has no real agency in the choice if you cast it at the end of his or her end step, because you'll draw the card he puts on top in a moment anyway, taking away from the element of choice. Also, because you bottom a card first, you will always draw the two best cards of the three you reveal, no matter what your opponent does. With Court Machinations, villain has the choice to put a land on top, for example, giving you immediate access to the best card, but also forcing you to bottom the second-best card. Or he could top the best card, delaying your access to it for a turn, but allowing you to bottom a bad card. Also, because it's a sorcery, the aspect of choice has a more meaningful impact, because your opponent actually gets a turn to prepare for the card he put on top.As for the equipment, I would pick the second. The mana ability feels more impactful, and the slew of abilities a little less over the top for the equip cost.
Chris Taylor
Contributor
I kinda don't want a brainstorm variant that can fuck you though, and villain's ability to make sure you draw a land certainly can fuck you.
Instant is mostly for prowess concerns though, so that can change.
Instant is mostly for prowess concerns though, so that can change.
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
I have to disagree here, since the land was already in the top 3 cards. In other words, if the land is going to fuck you, you were already fucked to begin with.
Chris Taylor
Contributor
There's also the issue that Court Machinations will never get you a card you want (I've also had this problem with epiphany at the drownyard)
For Eg: Lightning Bolt, Land, Land with your opponent at 3 actually ends up with you worse off than before.
Edit: Wait no, your opponent chooses what goes on top, not what goes on bottom. God just reading all these, they're blending together! I hope my drafters don't feel this way...
Fuck it. I'm gonna try machinations.
For Eg: Lightning Bolt, Land, Land with your opponent at 3 actually ends up with you worse off than before.
Edit: Wait no, your opponent chooses what goes on top, not what goes on bottom. God just reading all these, they're blending together! I hope my drafters don't feel this way...
Fuck it. I'm gonna try machinations.
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
Hahaha, yeah, Court Machinations and Compromise are really alike
Both cards let you keep the best card though. Actually, in the Bolt, land, land scenario, I bet Bolt is going to end up on top of your library with both cards 
Have I mentioned how I love investigate? These could probably be Azorius or blue cards, but I feel like white needs investigate more.
Crack the Case
Sorcery
Investigate X times, then you may detain up to X target creatures your opponents control.
Crack the Case
Sorcery
Retrace
Investigate, then detain up to one target creature an opponent controls.
Law and Order
Whenever you attack with two or more creatures, investigate.
Whenever you sacrifice a clue, you may pay. If you do, detain target creature an opponent controls.
Also speaking of card quality in white, I'd like to see is a pushed version of Not Forgotten as the effect seems really versatile in terms of either being graveyard hate, blanking an opponent's draw step by sticking something bad on their deck, or increasing your card quality in the mid-to-late game.
Crack the Case
Sorcery
Investigate X times, then you may detain up to X target creatures your opponents control.
Crack the Case
Sorcery
Retrace
Investigate, then detain up to one target creature an opponent controls.
Law and Order
Whenever you attack with two or more creatures, investigate.
Whenever you sacrifice a clue, you may pay
. If you do, detain target creature an opponent controls.Also speaking of card quality in white, I'd like to see is a pushed version of Not Forgotten as the effect seems really versatile in terms of either being graveyard hate, blanking an opponent's draw step by sticking something bad on their deck, or increasing your card quality in the mid-to-late game.
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
I like the middle card!
Weird Scalable time walk thing? X1
Choose X:
After the current phase there is an additional Untap phase if G was spent to cast ~.
After the current phase there is an additional Draw phase if U was spent to cast ~.
After the current phase there is an additional main phase if W was spent to cast ~.
After the current phase there is an additional Combat phase if R was spent to cast ~.
Screw black? Also not sure if I have reverse the order or not for it to work naturally.
Choose X:
After the current phase there is an additional Untap phase if G was spent to cast ~.
After the current phase there is an additional Draw phase if U was spent to cast ~.
After the current phase there is an additional main phase if W was spent to cast ~.
After the current phase there is an additional Combat phase if R was spent to cast ~.
Screw black? Also not sure if I have reverse the order or not for it to work naturally.
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
> > 
???
Laz
Developer
Chris Taylor
Contributor
The thing is that's also a power level curve
5 toughness is a tall order, but the idea that someone's turn 4 might be not a 3/4, and then they've got maybe 1 permanent in play?
Part of makes wildfire at all fair is that A) theres a surprising amount of persist and/or x/5's that other decks will be playing like Sidisi and Polukranos, and that your deck also wants a bunch of things that survive wildfire, so your curve is absolutely awful.
5 toughness is a tall order, but the idea that someone's turn 4 might be not a 3/4, and then they've got maybe 1 permanent in play?
Part of makes wildfire at all fair is that A) theres a surprising amount of persist and/or x/5's that other decks will be playing like Sidisi and Polukranos, and that your deck also wants a bunch of things that survive wildfire, so your curve is absolutely awful.
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
I was wondering if the number 3 variant might be too powerful, because it's much easier to build around. I think the number 2 variant is a lot fairer, once again, but probably a lot less desirable. Basically the deck you want to have a 2 damage sweeper against is the same deck that would gladly have "each player sacrifices two lands" as a side effect on one of its spells.The thing is that's also a power level curve
5 toughness is a tall order, but the idea that someone's turn 4 might be not a 3/4, and then they've got maybe 1 permanent in play?
Part of makes wildfire at all fair is that A) theres a surprising amount of persist and/or x/5's that other decks will be playing like Sidisi and Polukranos, and that your deck also wants a bunch of things that survive wildfire, so your curve is absolutely awful.
