General Custom Cards: The Lab

Rusje

Rusje

Jason Waddell said:
I didn't even say it was from my kid. How dare you (correctly) assume!
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Well, experience? Those little rascals are lovely and nice. But preschools/crèches have more germs/viruses than I would dare to count.
Funny thing is that the children are often much better at handling those buggers than the grown ups.

Speedy recovery!
 
Velrun

Velrun

Jason Waddell said:
Vel, take a big chill pill please. I have too much stomach flu in me at the moment to deal with this properly. Since the last exodus, all the conflict here happens via one person, please self evaluate and change perspective.
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I am chill.

This is not chill:
https://riptidelab.com/forum/threads/custom-cards-the-lab.403/post-119622

Just because a lot of people disagree and use lengthy comments to shout over each other doesn’t’ make them right, nor does it make me wrong, nor does it make me anti chill. I have said I will nog engage in conversations with people like this yet people still keep commenting very un-chilling with ‘I just want to’ and ‘Answer me this’ type of comments. There is no stopping them even when I’ve said in many threads that I do not respect the topic or the way it is handled. I am literally the only chill person in here these days. Something you will see if you carefully read the comments. Please do not direct a command at me just because most other people disagree with my opinion. If they would be quiet, things would solve themself.
 
Jason Waddell

Jason Waddell

Administrator
Staff member
Velrun said:
I am chill.

This is not chill:
https://riptidelab.com/forum/threads/custom-cards-the-lab.403/post-119622

Just because a lot of people disagree and use lengthy comments to shout over each other doesn’t’ make them right, nor does it make me wrong, nor does it make me anti chill. I have said I will nog engage in conversations with people like this yet people still keep commenting very un-chilling with ‘I just want to’ and ‘Answer me this’ type of comments. There is no stopping them even when I’ve said in many threads that I do not respect the topic or the way it is handled. I am literally the only chill person in here these days. Something you will see if you carefully read the comments. Please do not direct a command at me just because most other people disagree with my opinion. If they would be quiet, things would solve themself.
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Bye bye.
 
K

Karshtakavaar

Apologies all for setting this off - still new and unaware of the personalities around here. Did not anticipate this kind of escalation from a custom concept in the wrong thread. Hoping we can get back to comfy asap.

Happy to receive any input on my conduct via PM as well, would rather not contribute to similar situations in future if I can in any way help it.
 
Onderzeeboot

Onderzeeboot

Ecstatic Orb
Karshtakavaar said:
Apologies all for setting this off - still new and unaware of the personalities around here. Did not anticipate this kind of escalation from a custom concept in the wrong thread. Hoping we can get back to comfy asap.

Happy to receive any input on my conduct via PM as well, would rather not contribute to similar situations in future if I can in any way help it.
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You did absolutely nothing wrong! <3 I enjoy engaging in discussion, and for some reason this has me end up in an escalating argument with Velrun every now and then. While I can be persistent, I try my best to discuss in a polite and civil manner, and I honestly don't know what it is in my way of posting that ticks him off so much :(
 
Rusje

Rusje

Apologies all for setting this off - still new and unaware of the personalities around here. Did not anticipate this kind of escalation from a custom concept in the wrong thread. Hoping we can get back to comfy asap.
Karshtakavaar said:
Happy to receive any input on my conduct via PM as well, would rather not contribute to similar situations in future if I can in any way help it.
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Please keep posting. That someone went a bit of rails has nothing to do with your post.
Velrun can add a lot of good things but sometimes is a bit sharp. The last few posts of Velrun were strange, not creating an good environment for discussion, and some were even downright baffling. They were also unlike Velrun from before. I hope that Velrun is alright since something which I did not find aggravating made Velrun go off like a rocket.
 
spicewitch

spicewitch

I was listening to lucky paper and they mentioned gitaxian probe kinda ruining one of their games. And I was thinking how annoying it is that gp can be popped into *any* deck. So I was tryna come up with a variation that's similarly easy to cast but less busted.
 
Onderzeeboot

Onderzeeboot

Ecstatic Orb
I was about to say, fateseal is a keyword that technically exists :) It was featured on only two cards, but one of them saw extensive play in Commander, before they changed the tuck rule. Nowadays you can put your commander in your command zone any time it changes zones, but back then, Spin into Myth got semi-permanently rid of a commander (until a lucky shuffle or a tutor, anyway).

That said, Mark Rosewater gave fateseal an 8 on the Storm Scale, because "the mechanic isn't particularly fun". I don't think putting fateseal on a Peek card is going to add to that fun factor, since hidden information is such a big part of the game. Incidentally, Peek might be the alternative you're looking for :)
 
Mown

Mown

I'm not going to pretend that Velrun was the reasonable person in this exchange, but I already expected that he wouldn't be beforehand, so I feel like there's a level of poking the bear that could have been avoided with relative ease here. While he didn't enrich my personal forum experience, it also required very little of me to facilitate his ability to coexist here, so prodding him into a conversation he doesn't want, predictably resulting in him (as I understand it) getting banned because Jason (quite reasonably) doesn't want to manage a kindergarten does holistically feel kind of sad, even if my personal feelings on it are kind of whatever.

And to be clear, I'm not grandstanding in hindsight. I did consider to suggest dropping the topic before it escalated, but it would be somewhat hypocritical of me to do so since I somewhat participated in it, if rather passively. idk, the warning signs seemed pretty clear to me, but maybe you have to be highly judgmental to see them.
 
Onderzeeboot

Onderzeeboot

Ecstatic Orb
Mown said:
I'm not going to pretend that Velrun was the reasonable person in this exchange, but I already expected that he wouldn't be beforehand, so I feel like there's a level of poking the bear that could have been avoided with relative ease here. While he didn't enrich my personal forum experience, it also required very little of me to facilitate his ability to coexist here, so prodding him into a conversation he doesn't want, predictably resulting in him (as I understand it) getting banned because Jason (quite reasonably) doesn't want to manage a kindergarten does holistically feel kind of sad, even if my personal feelings on it are kind of whatever.

And to be clear, I'm not grandstanding in hindsight. I did consider to suggest dropping the topic before it escalated, but it would be somewhat hypocritical of me to do so since I somewhat participated in it, if rather passively. idk, the warning signs seemed pretty clear to me, but maybe you have to be highly judgmental to see them.
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I honestly thought he was annoyed at a custom card discussion not taking place in the Custom card thread, but at the same time he kept participating in the discussion. I thought I was doing him a favor by moving the discussion here and was legitimately interested in hearing his reasons for calling the design broken. At no point was I trying to "poke the bear" :(
 
TrainmasterGT

TrainmasterGT

Rusje said:
They were also unlike Velrun from before. I hope that Velrun is alright since something which I did not find aggravating made Velrun go off like a rocket.
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This actually isn't the first time Velrun has done something like this, he goes off about bizarre stuff sometimes. He's had blow-ups about the lack of legendary status for certain land cards in standard (on three separate occasions) and whether or not Nyxborn Courser and friends should be enchantments. He even went after me once because I said I wanted to use the old-frame Ponder in my Cube instead of the m15 frame version because I viewed it as a Legacy card. These occurrences are fairly infrequent, but there is an unfortunate pattern of behavior here. Heated disagreements are fine occasionally, but I am alarmed by the increasing frequency at which they have been devolving into outright fights as of late, oftentimes due in part or in whole by Velrun's contributions.

Mown said:
I'm not going to pretend that Velrun was the reasonable person in this exchange, but I already expected that he wouldn't be beforehand, so I feel like there's a level of poking the bear that could have been avoided with relative ease here.
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I do wonder at what point having to worry about the bear is worth the effort, though. I've personally been using the forums a lot less in the past 6 months because I don't want to be involved in huge Cube arguments anymore. It's not worth it! While I don't want to pretend this is specifically because of Velrun, the last incident with him was the driving factor that made me decide to stop posting about controversial topics as often or at all. It's getting to the point where I don't want to comment on anything where I might disagree with a sentiment being expressed specifically to waking a "bear" and triggering an argument. While I wouldn't characterize Velrun as the only bear in the Cube community or on the Forums, I've definitely witheld a great number of otherwise non-offensive posts to avoid provoking him.

Between the blatant transphobia in the Cube Talk discord community, the boorish attitude of portions of the Cube Brainstorming community, the inactivity of Riptide's discord, the uselessness of Reddit, and the increasing number of "bearish" members on the Forums, it just feels impossible to find any good place to publicly discuss Cube design anymore. The primary group setting I've had meaningful Cube discussion in almost a year has been on my private discord, but that only (You know who you are and I love you all!), and the conversation there mostly ends up being about memes and custom card tweaking more often than Cube design theory. I'm not complaining because it's nice to have a close group, but losing a broader swath of perspectives is a genuine downside of this approach.

Above all else, I just don't want anymore conflict.
 
Onderzeeboot

Onderzeeboot

Ecstatic Orb
Zoss said:
Look, as the person who brought up Retrace in the first place, I feel awful about how this ended up as well. On the bright side, even apart from this debacle, there's been an uptick in activity here which has been really cool to see!
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I thought it was a proper fun discussion. I've been on these board for a looooong time, and years ago the number of lateral thinkers and/or mischievous spirits on here was so high that literally every thread would derail into some tangent on a topic that, strictly speaking, belonged in another thread. And nobody cared. The entire premise of this forum was to throw off the chains that used to shackle the Cube discourse in other places back then. I'm super glad other communities have come around to things like breaking singleton and running custom cards, and you don't get told off for "weird" cube ideas that don't fit the mold anymore. In a sense, we're not the beacon of "free thought" we once were anymore, because such a beacon isn't needed anymore. RiptideLab is still a sweet place to discuss those off the wall ideas, though, because it's baked into our genes, and that's what makes this place so great in my mind. I feel like that discussion shouldn't get stifled because people don't want to bring up potentially controversial or off topic ideas anymore, so keep talking about your hopes and dreams towards e.g. particular keywords getting more love, with the help of customs if need be.
 
Rusje

Rusje

TrainmasterGT said:
This actually isn't the first time Velrun has done something like this, he goes off about bizarre stuff sometimes. He's had blow-ups about the lack of legendary status for certain land cards in standard (on three separate occasions) and whether or not Nyxborn Courser and friends should be enchantments. He even went after me once because I said I wanted to use the old-frame Ponder in my Cube instead of the m15 frame version because I viewed it as a Legacy card. These occurrences are fairly infrequent, but there is an unfortunate pattern of behavior here. Heated disagreements are fine occasionally, but I am alarmed by the increasing frequency at which they have been devolving into outright fights as of late, oftentimes due in part or in whole by Velrun's contributions.


I do wonder at what point having to worry about the bear is worth the effort, though. I've personally been using the forums a lot less in the past 6 months because I don't want to be involved in huge Cube arguments anymore. It's not worth it! While I don't want to pretend this is specifically because of Velrun, the last incident with him was the driving factor that made me decide to stop posting about controversial topics as often or at all. It's getting to the point where I don't want to comment on anything where I might disagree with a sentiment being expressed specifically to waking a "bear" and triggering an argument. While I wouldn't characterize Velrun as the only bear in the Cube community or on the Forums, I've definitely witheld a great number of otherwise non-offensive posts to avoid provoking him.

Between the blatant transphobia in the Cube Talk discord community, the boorish attitude of portions of the Cube Brainstorming community, the inactivity of Riptide's discord, the uselessness of Reddit, and the increasing number of "bearish" members on the Forums, it just feels impossible to find any good place to publicly discuss Cube design anymore. The primary group setting I've had meaningful Cube discussion in almost a year has been on my private discord, but that only (You know who you are and I love you all!), and the conversation there mostly ends up being about memes and custom card tweaking more often than Cube design theory. I'm not complaining because it's nice to have a close group, but losing a broader swath of perspectives is a genuine downside of this approach.

Above all else, I just don't want anymore conflict.
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I am truly saddened that you stopped posting beautiful ideas due to previous lengthy arguments. This forum should help each other out by improving the ideas and learn from others why some ideas did not pan out as intended. Arguments what colour frame/sleeves can be valid (e.g readability of the cards), but if they are all readable why should the actual frame/colour matter?
 
K

Karshtakavaar

TrainmasterGT said:
Many sad things
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Rusje said:
I am truly saddened that you stopped posting beautiful ideas due to previous lengthy arguments.
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I would like to second Rusje's sentiment here. I too really like getting into extended discussion on the merits and pitfalls of cards, archetypes, design approaches, and it really sucks that genuine rancor comes into those conversations - I personally cannot see how an opinion or perspective on a card game played for community enjoyment can be so deeply and dearly held that it ends up mattering more than the actual community playing the game. Doesn't stop me being argumentative as hell when the mood takes me, but there's no deep emotion it it beyond curiosity and a desire to develop and share my thoughts.

I for one would really like to hear your potentially contentious and controversial thoughts on magic and cubing specifically because it's so wonderful to be challenged on design and gameplay theory, and leads to more interesting Magic. If you do ever feel comfortable in sharing that kind of thing here again and I push back, please know it comes from a place of wanting to challenge and be challenged in turn, really develop ideas as best we are able, and in the absence of outright provocation (à la this latest drama) holds no deep emotional weight over me.
 
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