General Fight Club

LadyMapi

LadyMapi

Master is probably a more interesting card (unless your cube is bad at blue devotion, I guess?)

Mentor is a card I've always wanted to love, but it keeps countering my affection. :(
 
LadyMapi

LadyMapi

Yeah...

I feel like the passive ability is fine (a 2/2 for 1UU that makes bodies when you counter stuff is a little parasitic, but it's ultimately not going to break anyone's back), it's just that it has that big "tap all the feesh to counter target spell" ability. If you can't use that ability, it feels like the card isn't performing — if you can use that ability, it's a pretty frustrating win-more thing for villain to play against.

The funny thing is that, just from looking at them, you'd expect that Mentor is the less parasitic of these two cards:



But nope! It's actually Gilt-Leaf — Druids are kinda like humans, where there are a bunch of them that you can sprinkle around your cube quite nicely.
 
B

blacksmithy

LadyMapi said:
Yeah...

I feel like the passive ability is fine (a 2/2 for 1UU that makes bodies when you counter stuff is a little parasitic, but it's ultimately not going to break anyone's back), it's just that it has that big "tap all the feesh to counter target spell" ability. If you can't use that ability, it feels like the card isn't performing — if you can use that ability, it's a pretty frustrating win-more thing for villain to play against.

The funny thing is that, just from looking at them, you'd expect that Mentor is the less parasitic of these two cards:



But nope! It's actually Gilt-Leaf — Druids are kinda like humans, where there are a bunch of them that you can sprinkle around your cube quite nicely.
Click to expand...
LMAO that druid ability is HILARIOUS
 
K

Karshtakavaar

blacksmithy said:
LMAO that druid ability is HILARIOUS
Click to expand...

I have lost all my lands to it in Modern before. It was back in like, 2017 or something, and he did lose the match overall because Druid Tribal (Seriously, maindeck Treefolk Harbingers. 4 of them.) but you gotta give him props for managing it at all.

LadyMapi said:
I feel like the passive ability is fine (a 2/2 for 1UU that makes bodies when you counter stuff is a little parasitic, but it's ultimately not going to break anyone's back), it's just that it has that big "tap all the feesh to counter target spell" ability. If you can't use that ability, it feels like the card isn't performing — if you can use that ability, it's a pretty frustrating win-more thing for villain to play against.
Click to expand...
TBH, it's really only the passive I care about (Why is it so hard to make merfolk tokens goddamn), but yeah the potential for feelbads is real.
While I do want to live the dream of having the Mentor and Hexcatcher out together to make a really shitty Thalia, everyone is right about the play pattern being pretty un-fun.
TY for the input all <3
 
K

Karshtakavaar

Onderzeeboot said:
I like neither, to be honest. Lullmage Mentor looks plain underwhelming, and Master of Waves is both an army in a can and sports the super noninteractive “protection from red” rider.
Click to expand...

My other consideration for that slot is like, Emperor Mikhail II or Khod, Etlan Shiis Envoy which is a massive nosedive in power.
I'd also like to keep the same density of token makers in blue to prop up the Proteus Staff/Mass Polymorph/Synthetic Destiny deck that overlaps with red polymorph.
Actually, let's frame it this way: In a list that runs the following, which additional Merfolk would you run, if any?


Emry is kind of a false signpost, as I don't have any of the cheap stuff she likes to abuse, and Hullbreacher and Truename are way too good. Thieving Skydancer would steal like, Signets or 3/3 Golem tokens most likely.
(Vohar is being tested over Sygg who formerly supported the aggro feesh devotion thing I had going on, but when Svyelun replaced Thassa the devotion got less relevant, and Vohar looks sweet)
 
Onderzeeboot

Onderzeeboot

Ecstatic Orb
If you truly are supporting Merfolk, Emperor Mikhail II would certainly not be a nosedive in power, and I personally like it better than the other two options you presented. Being able to play (and admittedly small subsection of your deck) from the top of your deck is pretty sweet :) Personally, I also really like Jori En, Ruin Diver. Even though it doesn't create any tokens, it should provide a steady stream of cards in a typical Merfolk deck.

Edit: Branching Merfolk out into red gives you an excuse to run one of the best pingers!
 
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Zoss

Zoss



I love both of these cards, but they overlap and make the GB self-mill deck a little too linear for my taste. Which leads to the cooler variants of these decks, in your opinion?
 
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Zoss

Zoss

Mostly self-mill and discard, but cycling lands, sac lands, and horizon lands should get some lands into the GY. It's not fantastically easy the way a fetch-powered environment would be, but it's not particularly hard either.
 
sigh

sigh

Also spawning IMO. If you are worried about linearity, harvest can just become basically the only thing the player does for the rest of the game. Spawning you at least have to work on the setup first, then you can cash in.
 
ravnic

ravnic

If only black/green decks would play these anyway, then I'd also vote for Spawning. If something like a blue/black or red/green Worm Harvest deck is a realistic possibility, I'd prefer the hybrid.
 
Zoss

Zoss

Thanks for the feedback! Sounds like Spawning is what I want here, although the loss of the true hybrid cost is a real bummer. I really like retrace as a mechanic, it's a shame that it's so wonky to balance.


In that vein, has anyone tried running either of the following? The former seems really weak, but the latter might have legs as a control wincon, albeit a really slow one.

 
PyreDream

PyreDream

I like Cenn's Enlistment at pauper level, though it's slowly inching out as speed increases. It's mostly a midrange/control card, but I also appreciate the ability for aggro decks to convert dead lands past turn four into bodies on the board, and two casts is enough to start tilting the board in your favor if you're more defensively minded. Pauper cubes also have access to a few mass pump effects (Rhox Veteran, Rally the Peasants) to upsize the damage very efficiently. If you're not constrained by rarity, it plays nicely with anthems and overruns, I suppose.

Syphon Life is not a wincon I'd be happy to run in control since it doesn't help me stabilize the board. I see it more as a specialized card for Loam decks. I could also see it slotting into some sort of Dimir cycling/discard-matters package with Lazotep Chancellor and some friends from Amonkhet, alongside a pinch of conniving.
 
alvoi

alvoi

Syphon Life is a way to close games in some Life from the Loam decks, it's not the best card to do that but in a mid-low powered cube it can work. Cenn's Enlistment is more of a slow aggro card, but I would play it only if I had some token support
 
ravnic

ravnic

I had Cenn's Enlistment in my Cube some years ago and it was fine. Really nice way to avoid the feelbad of flooding. I cut it for Battle Screech I think, and I wouldn't undo that, but I wonder if it's worth another try now with Crucible, LftL and World Shaper in my List ...
 
Onderzeeboot

Onderzeeboot

Ecstatic Orb
Enlistment is on the verge of underwhelming and undercosted :oops: Like, I feel like it should cost {2}{W} or even {1}{W} to be able to compete in typical cubes, but at that point you also run the risk it becomes overbearing. You know, I think I should try it out in my "everything costs {1} less" cube (that's been in the concept stage forever lol)
 
ravnic

ravnic

Throes of Chaos is cool. But is it good? What kind of decks run it? Loam decks? Can it just be a kind of curve topper that prevents you from flooding?
 
Mown

Mown

I've no idea. I have it in to justify including Life from the Loam, and because it counts as two spells for triggers like prowess.
 
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