At what point does this end up being kinda oppressive if you have a bunch of good auras like rancor and gryff's boon?
Card/Deck Low Power Card Spotlight
- Thread starter Grillo_Parlante
- Start date
At what point does this end up being kinda oppressive if you have a bunch of good auras like rancor and gryff's boon?
Love this as low powered. I thought lifelink / spell fx (sofi, etc.), and then evasion as the most egregious abilities to grant shroud critters. You can also add first strike/double strike to fight this type of creature. Probably acceptible with only a few cards that turn it into a sphinx of the steel wind. Any more than that in a given color pair is GRBS.
Lot of dials you can turn on that one. I think my cube has been enough different configs where that card was not very good and really awesome. Speed factors in. How fast are decks? Do they have evasion to get around things like this? How many enablers do you have to make the troll super nasty? How many answers do you have to those enablers (disenchants) and to troll itself (edicts).
In today's cubing world, I don't think the Troll is overpowered except in very low powered or super durdly cubes.
In today's cubing world, I don't think the Troll is overpowered except in very low powered or super durdly cubes.
Well you're in the low power spotlight thread.
I've only got some "proof of concept" decks on my desk right now that I'm tuning to represent the kind of cube I'd like to put together. Troll's in the GW auras / land disruption deck right now, so maybe it'd be worth to just try it and see how it plays? Maybe it'd be ok to have some "cheap" victories.
Grillo_Parlante
Contributor
Its been fine, with the one rancor I support occasionally making it both a hard target and hard clock to beat. Its hard to support auras at my format's level of efficiency though without rancor.
It does tend to have a warping effect on some games.
For troll to be really good it has to be able to act as a source of inevitability: real credible pressure being asserted that the game is now about. In that board state it can feel overwhelming, or even unbeatable with evasive auras, but outside of it, negligible or even anemic. Really weird card.
It does tend to have a warping effect on some games.
For troll to be really good it has to be able to act as a source of inevitability: real credible pressure being asserted that the game is now about. In that board state it can feel overwhelming, or even unbeatable with evasive auras, but outside of it, negligible or even anemic. Really weird card.
Grillo_Parlante
Contributor
Is running these two a better low power living death?
Shifting the discussion a bit, I have to say I really love Bone Shredder (execution-wise, it's not the most "exciting" card ever, obviously) and it's a shame that they're not going to print more echo cards since "drawback mechanics" are so hugely unpopular. However, I think it's a great way to handle "spell effects attached to bodies". Here's a quick breakdown I made (let me know if I miss anything really saucy)
Busted And You Should Be Ashamed
Obviously Playable
Generally Playable
More Questionable
Who here has experience with the echo creatures I've thrown in Generally Playable/More Questionable? I'd be interested in exploring more echo creatures.
I've played a fair bit with Keldon Champion and Crater Hellion. I have to say I've really liked both cards, though clearly neither of them are very flexible in terms of which decks they go into. If you'd play Wildfire in your cube/deck, you should absolutely consider Crater Hellion. It makes for a really interesting effect and combines well with various reanimation/blink effects. Keldon Champion is lower in power level for sure but I like it as a step down from your Hellriders and Heroes of Oxid Ridge.
I can't speak to any experience with it, but Yavimaya Granger strikes me as an interesting Rampant Growth effect for cubes that are sacrifice or blink focused.
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
Crater Hellion is awesome. The only reason I cut it is because it overlaps functionally with big Chandra.
Crater Hellion is much better than "generally playable". Many games, I'm falling over myself to pay echo on that after it essentially wiped the board.
Keldon Vandals is another one that I actually like. Depending on how often it will have a target, but the body is a lot better I feel than Manic Vandal, and can present pressure against control decks - taking out their mana rock and being a 4 power beater.
Keldon Vandals is another one that I actually like. Depending on how often it will have a target, but the body is a lot better I feel than Manic Vandal, and can present pressure against control decks - taking out their mana rock and being a 4 power beater.
Speaking of Crater Hellion, here's another Low Power Card to spotlight:
I used to play it alongside Crater Hellion in a very disorganized, low power cube I had awhile ago and that was always awesome. It also combines well with decks that are going wide: imagine you had a Siege-Gang Commander or Cloudgoat Ranger or the new Angel of Invention and Torrent of Souls'd it. It's a lot of value and a lot of damage, but you do have to go pretty deep to make it realize its full potential.
I used to play it alongside Crater Hellion in a very disorganized, low power cube I had awhile ago and that was always awesome. It also combines well with decks that are going wide: imagine you had a Siege-Gang Commander or Cloudgoat Ranger or the new Angel of Invention and Torrent of Souls'd it. It's a lot of value and a lot of damage, but you do have to go pretty deep to make it realize its full potential.
I couldn't for the life of me get Torrent of Souls to work. It reads awesome, felt like it fit in a lot of decks. But just was never what I needed when I could cast it.
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
Torrent of Souls is certified awesomeness!
Wait, torrent + siege gang commander doesn't give the tokens haste, right?
No, but it gets the previous ones at least.
I'm a really big fan of Torrent of Souls, especially in lists with Sneak Attack. I kinda wish it said 'from any graveyard' for power level purposes, but the design is great for what those two colors are up to in my cube.
Hunting Moa is another sweet design and might be a good starting point for a more pushed custom card.
Hunting Moa is another sweet design and might be a good starting point for a more pushed custom card.
Sure it does. "Creatures target player controls get +2/+0 and haste until end of turn." I ran Torrent of Souls for a long time and it never did anything. My list has a pretty highish power level, though, so it might not have had room to breathe. In a lower power list it could shine.
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
This is correct.
Grillo_Parlante
Contributor
Some random sweet ones; no idea how they fit in:
It's about breaking the symmetry, right? I think RW is easier to put in your favor with first or double strikers. It also just shuts down any smaller creatures. RW control? Could be a sweet incentive, albeit a possible GRBS.
The GR one let's your opponent untap with a loot of mana (6 or 8). What if they play a threat and then answer the mana doubler? I don't think that would be worth the 3-4 damage that would've dealt.
The GR one let's your opponent untap with a loot of mana (6 or 8). What if they play a threat and then answer the mana doubler? I don't think that would be worth the 3-4 damage that would've dealt.
I have this in my Pikula tribute grid, but it's yet to been played. Hoping to see it in (1) Replenish/Starfield of Nyx, (2) 4c control or (3) midrange RW (with Thick-Skinned Goblins).
Grillo_Parlante
Contributor
I know, its so weird though that a R/G heartbeat of spring existed in the old frame. What was it designed for?
With any of those effects, they are terrible until you add land untaps. Ideally you want to wait until the turn you plan to use all of that mana, drop the enchantment, hit your untap effect, and than do something big. Thats why the 3cc cost on heartbeat (and presumably on this) are a big deal, since you are likely to have enough left early mana to cast your early harvest or whatever.