Card/Deck Low Power Card Spotlight

[Zoss]

For the Tools of Royalty, my biggest problem is with the Scepter of Empires. The other two seem plausible, but pinging for one a turn seems exceptionally mediocre.

The other two sets seem fine, though Bogbrew Witch is especially mediocre without the rest of the set. Maybe the Witch is a freebie with each of the other two?

The Unspeakable actually seems non-embarrassing in a mid-powered cube with some sort of reanimation touching Blue, and the three hand manipulation spells are perfectly fine, though Sift Through Sands is a little weak without graveyard themes. This is my favorite set of the three because I can see each part making the maindeck in non-combo decks. I've never seen this set, so thanks for sharing! Do you know of any other sets that work similar to these?

 

[LadyMapi]

Of the other sets I can think of, two of them probably don't belong in this thread (the Kaldra set and Tron) and the rest are pretty bad (sticking to the sets of 3+ cards that reference specific card names, to skip over the Planeswalker search cards and stuff like Kookus):






And, of course:

 

[ravnic]

Looking for potential control cards, I stumbled across this one:



It seems like an interesting take on a board wipe. It stops all X/2s and smaller immediately, as they would just die in an attack, but they are not dead. So if the the aggressor finds an enchantment removal, he can't attack with them again. Also, a toughness boost can help some or all creatures to survive and potentially attack. These are weaknesses obviously, but it should make this card more interesting than "destroy all creatures", which I wouldn't add at cmc 4 anyway.

But Powerstone Minefield also has upsides. It does not only stop the X/2s on board immediately, but also all small creatures that might come down the following turns. That is nice for the control player. But maybe it could be frustrating for the aggro player, who can't find any answers? It might come down to how many X/3s or bigger aggro decks can play. I don't think that number is high in my cube however.

I think typing this I kinda talked myself out of this card. Not sure. I'm still gonna post it anyway

 

[LadyMapi]

If you want a cheaper/smaller version of that effect, why not try Circle of Flame? It's half the damage for half the mana and half the colors. It's less of a board wipe (though it does stop armies of 1/1 tokens cold), and more of a way for a control deck to trade more efficiently.

I'm also reminded of the most Boros-y fog effects ever:

 

[James Stevenson]

Of the other sets I can think of, two of them probably don't belong in this thread (the Kaldra set and Tron) and the rest are pretty bad (sticking to the sets of 3+ cards that reference specific card names, to skip over the Planeswalker search cards and stuff like Kookus):






And, of course:

Hang on...

 

[TrainmasterGT]

Looking for potential control cards, I stumbled across this one:



It seems like an interesting take on a board wipe. It stops all X/2s and smaller immediately, as they would just die in an attack, but they are not dead. So if the the aggressor finds an enchantment removal, he can't attack with them again. Also, a toughness boost can help some or all creatures to survive and potentially attack. These are weaknesses obviously, but it should make this card more interesting than "destroy all creatures", which I wouldn't add at cmc 4 anyway.

But Powerstone Minefield also has upsides. It does not only stop the X/2s on board immediately, but also all small creatures that might come down the following turns. That is nice for the control player. But maybe it could be frustrating for the aggro player, who can't find any answers? It might come down to how many X/3s or bigger aggro decks can play. I don't think that number is high in my cube however.

I think typing this I kinda talked myself out of this card. Not sure. I'm still gonna post it anyway

Powerstone Minefield can't kill the opponent's utility creatures, which is an important part of a board wipe. It also doesn't kill anything larger than an x/2. While it is good at stonewalling aggro decks trying to curve three one-drops into a Goblin Rabblemaster, that's about it.

Some better options would be:

Deafening Clarion fills the same basic role as Powerstone Minefield, except it can kill more things and eliminate the opponent's utility dorks.

Firemane Angel shouldn't need an introduction here, but I like this card a lot. You can discard her early to red's card filtering spells, start gaining loads of life, and eventually bring her back into play.

I also like Nahiri, the Harbinger for controlling red/white decks, but since you don't run walkers I'm not going to recommend her. She is a good option though if you ever decide to go that direction.

 

[ravnic]

If you want a cheaper/smaller version of that effect, why not try Circle of Flame? It's half the damage for half the mana and half the colors. It's less of a board wipe (though it does stop armies of 1/1 tokens cold), and more of a way for a control deck to trade more efficiently.

I'm also reminded of the most Boros-y fog effects ever:

Damn, Intimidation Bolt is kinda cool. It is always an Open Fire, but if you're not the aggressor it can additionally buy you a lot of time.
Master Warcraft i have run before. It is often just a Panic effect or sits in side boards. Sad, cause the card is so cool.

Powerstone Minefield can't kill the opponent's utility creatures, which is an important part of a board wipe. It also doesn't kill anything larger than an x/2. While it is good at stonewalling aggro decks trying to curve three one-drops into a Goblin Rabblemaster, that's about it.

Some better options would be:

Deafening Clarion fills the same basic role as Powerstone Minefield, except it can kill more things and eliminate the opponent's utility dorks.

Firemane Angel shouldn't need an introduction here, but I like this card a lot. You can discard her early to red's card filtering spells, start gaining loads of life, and eventually bring her back into play.

I also like Nahiri, the Harbinger for controlling red/white decks, but since you don't run walkers I'm not going to recommend her. She is a good option though if you ever decide to go that direction.

Both of these are very sweet suggestions! I'm strongly considering each of those now.
Just in case at some point some one else might be looking for controlling boros cards, here is another one:



At first, the option to play it as a Hill Giant with a horrible drawback might confuse drafters. However, if you're a control deck with no creatures on board, the option to just play this as a blocker sometimes might be a necessary evil, and it's definitely better to have the option than not to have it.

I just kinda wish he had the gold border

 

[LadyMapi]

On the topic of Boros control options (in a wide mix of power levels):



...

I think you could probably build a pretty decent control-y RW Artifacts archetype. It'd be a nice change from All Attacks All The Time, honestly.

EDIT: Or Boros Defender, with Flamewright as a signal. There are a bunch of interesting Defenders in Red and White, it'd let you run sweet boardwipes like Solar Blaze, and you have multiple win conditions you could build towards:

 

[LadyMapi]

On a different topic, what are people's opinions of

?

I'm fond of the little angel - she buffs incidental lifegain (like, say, from a Firemane Angel) and lifelink, and if you have the necessary life threshold, she's a flying 4/4 for 3. But that's mostly just from using it in casual constructed decks, so I have no idea how good it would be in a draft.

 

[sigh]

RE: boros control, my favorite red sweeper for the archetype


RE: the angel, it's quite a fun effect, but I'm not sure how consistent it will be in a cube draft environment. If you have a dedicated chunk of life gain effects, it is worth a deeper ponder at the very least.

 

[Brad]

I was gonna mention Solar Blaze. Seems like you could easily build around it with some X/(X+Y)s. That said, it hits pretty early and sweeps most aggro creatures, so it might just be RW Wrath most of the time at a quick 4 mana. Similarly, the 3 mana 3 damage sweepers are punishing as hell.

 

[ravnic]

On a different topic, what are people's opinions of

?

I'm fond of the little angel - she buffs incidental lifegain (like, say, from a Firemane Angel) and lifelink, and if you have the necessary life threshold, she's a flying 4/4 for 3. But that's mostly just from using it in casual constructed decks, so I have no idea how good it would be in a draft.

She's going in and out of my cube. She is great in the lifegain decks as an above curve evasive beater that helps itself to get there. My girlfriend lives this card and the decks it goes in. There are two problems however: In any deck without lifegain the Angel is just a wind drake, you need to really go for 5+ lifegain sources, probably more if they're one shit effects or only give you small amounts. And the other problem is more related to how the theme works in my cube specifically. The deck wants lifegain triggers more than huge numbers, since it's an aggro deck, and it also wants to utilize black life payments or undercosted creatures with life loss attached, and that makes it hard to stay above 25 life.

 

[ravnic]

I wantvto talk about two cards, a combo, today. Alone, both are relatively low in power level. But together? Is that combo GRBS or is it a fun thing to have in a list?

 

[sigh]

I can't personally see how that combo can be GRBS. If you want to power out a "huge" army you are spending multiple turns devoting probably all your sources to pseudo-vanilla 1/1s. I think it's a good combo for white weenie decks, giving them a powerful value engine that can help them actually close a game.

 

[japahn]

I don't like play patterns that reward you for doing the same thing over and over, ignoring your hand, and just waiting to see if your opponent can deal with it. This has Pack Rat feelings, though as a two-card combo it will be far less consistent. It is somewhat difficult to disrupt too, requiring instant speed creature removal or artifact removal. I think the reaction will depend largely on playgroup. If you like the two cards individually, I'd say leave them there and see if someone assembles the combo and it becomes a problem.

 

[Onderzeeboot]

I cut the combo from my cube because I didn't find the repetitiveness fun, plus paying only a single for each 1/1 soldier is actually a rather powerful rate in any cube where you have time to assemble and capitalize on a combo like this.

 

[LadyMapi]

There's another set of cards that go really well with Oketra's Monument that aren't just "spam a bunch of Warriors by bouncing cards into my hand":



The Monument makes creatures that you can mutate onto, and both the "cast a creature" trigger and the cost reduction work with Mutate. You'd just have to figure out which Mutate cards are worth cubing (if any).

 

[LadyMapi]

Double posting with a completely different question about White... Are there enough cards for "White is Actually Black" to be a mini-theme, given that the following are basically the only non-tribal sac outlets and non-overpriced discard outlets I'm aware of in White? Assume that the power level is really low, if necessary.



I'm mostly asking because it would let me run the ultimate payoff as a signal:

 

[Onderzeeboot]

Double posting with a completely different question about White... Are there enough cards for "White is Actually Black" to be a mini-theme

Short answer: No.

Long answer: There isn't enough support or payoff there to support the theme in mono-white, but there are enough cards there to support it in or . I imagine it would take a bit of tinkering to make sure isn't going to steal the thunder from the white pairings, but that's a matter of tweaking the numbers.



These are all solid cards in the right environment, the Crier in particular has nice cross appeal for discard matters and sacrifice, since it builds multiple bodies. The other options you mention feel a lot weaker.

I don't think Bartered Cow is the payoff you're looking for, but I'm pretty sure you were only joking there. Other options would be Dearly Departed and Glory (careful with that last one though!). With the right support, Angel of Alabaster, Auriok Salvagers, and Eternal Dragon can return discard fodder to your hand. Chronosavant is kind of interesting as well. I can also recommend Gryff's Boon, a nifty little card that often performs much better than it looks on first sight. Obviously Sun Titan and Reveillark are old favorites when it comes to abusing the graveyard in white.

 

[Aston]

I wantvto talk about two cards, a combo, today. Alone, both are relatively low in power level. But together? Is that combo GRBS or is it a fun thing to have in a list?

In my unbiased opinion, it's fine.

 

[Onderzeeboot]

unbiased

LIAR!

 

[LadyMapi]

Yeah, Bartered Cow was a joke.

...

On a different note...



I feel like this card does a pretty decent mana dork impression while simultaneously being a 3/3 for 2R. How off-base am I?

 

[TrainmasterGT]

I wantvto talk about two cards, a combo, today. Alone, both are relatively low in power level. But together? Is that combo GRBS or is it a fun thing to have in a list?

I think this is actually a fun inclusion. While it can lead to a somewhat repetitive loop when it comes together, the chances that both cards survive without getting countered or nuked is pretty low. This is not like Pack Rat. Oketra's Monument is a good board advantage engine for White decks, so it's not exactly a bad card that just happens to go infinite with something else in the vein of Pestermite.

It's like having three Decoction Modules and Whirler Virtuoso in Kaladesh limited. Yes, there is a chance you get all of the pieces and go infinite, but it's more likely that you just have some good cards in your deck that sometimes do the thing and can win because of it.

 

[LadyMapi]

Ironically, I'm pretty sure this is a very solid pairing:

 

[japahn]

Does Kefnet's Monument stand on its own though? I don't think the combo with Pestermite is anywhere good enough to be worth running the Monument just for the combo.

It's totally besides the point, but it would be really funny to go T3 Monument, T4 Pestermite EOT, haha that's cute, T5 Splinter Twin.