Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
This is not a world I want to
Sets (MoM) April of the Machines Previews
- Thread starter Velrun
- Start date
I kinda skipped over OG Phyrexia because they were a completely different thing — for one thing, they didn't have the oil because Yawgmoth only perfected it just before he died. They couldn't phyrexianize buildings because a Phyrexian was a vat-grown dude called a Newt that got surgically altered into the different forms of phyrexian life (though I think they built some buildings out of them? I can't remember).
If I remember correctly, the idea behind the oil was that it was an invasion in a can, just add someone who knows how to compleat the victim... and then Mirrodin happened.
If I remember correctly, the idea behind the oil was that it was an invasion in a can, just add someone who knows how to compleat the victim... and then Mirrodin happened.
Thinking about the current plotline a little more...
I think that it could've been more effective if DMU and ONE had been split into a pair of sets each. Let's call them, I dunno... Dominaria United/Dominaria Besieged and ONE/TWO (I can't think of a good name for the second ONE set, so sue me
)
1) Elspeth gets tipped off in alt!New Capenna that Sheoldred is planning on invading Dominaria (because that's what Daddy Yawgmoth would've wanted).
2) DMU is spent with a bunch of planeswalkers running around trying to get Dominaria ready. Sheoldred's in the set... and so is Ajani, Sleeper Agent! They've had a mole in their midst the whole time.
3) Dominaria Besieged focuses on the actual invasion, as a big "hey, this is what it'd look like if New Phyrexia got their way!". This is the point where they hatch the mad plan to make their own sylex and travel back in time to see how it works (going back to BRO).
4) BRO happens. I liked BRO - it can stay the same.
5) ONE is the initial attempt to get the sylex to Phyrexia to blow stuff up. Assuming I can fiddle with the planeswalker line-up, they send in Elspeth (who meets up with Koth), Nissa and Vraska. This attempt to get the Sylex to the heart of Phyrexia fails, and the invasion force gets scattered. Elspeth escapes being compleated and gets back to Koth, while the other two get compleated (with compleated Nissa being the key to Realmbreaker working).
6) TWO is about Jace and Nahiri staging a rescue mission. Jace gets compleated by Vraska, but Nahiri meets up with Koth and Elspeth. Progress on Realmbreaker is mentioned and the possibility of the Sylex wrecking everything if it is comple(a)ted is discussed, but the decision is ultimately reached that they'd try to get the Sylex in position before it hits the "connect the multiverse" point.
Importantly, the planeswalkers are split here — Koth is adamant that no cost is too great to defeat Phyrexia, Nahiri is all "actually, I've recently learned that mass genocide is a bad thing — containment might be possible?", and Elspeth is on the fence. They get to the center of Phyrexia, see that Realmbreaker is activated... and Koth uses the Sylex anyway, while Nahiri tries to stop him. Elspeth grabs it and BAMFs away, leaving Nahiri alone and hopeless.
BOOM. IT'S MOM TIME. TIME FOR MOM.
...
The exact planeswalkers they send can vary (I'd definitely keep Elspeth, Jace, Koth, Nissa, and Vraska, if only because they cover the full, but also because they have the most interesting story beats), but it honestly flows better if we don't end up with two planeswalker cycles in a set that really shouldn't be focused on the planeswalkers.
This would also let them play with the factions on Phyrexia a bit more — ONE could be mostly just "here's the status quo", while TWO would be the set where Urabrask makes his bid to topple Elesh Norn.
EDIT: I cut the Emperor, Kaito, Lucca, and Tyvar because I'm not sure that there's a compelling reason for them to be in the set? We can stick the Emperor and Kaito back in one of the DMU sets, and Tyvar and Lucca can wait for MOM.
I think that it could've been more effective if DMU and ONE had been split into a pair of sets each. Let's call them, I dunno... Dominaria United/Dominaria Besieged and ONE/TWO (I can't think of a good name for the second ONE set, so sue me
)1) Elspeth gets tipped off in alt!New Capenna that Sheoldred is planning on invading Dominaria (because that's what Daddy Yawgmoth would've wanted).
2) DMU is spent with a bunch of planeswalkers running around trying to get Dominaria ready. Sheoldred's in the set... and so is Ajani, Sleeper Agent! They've had a mole in their midst the whole time.
3) Dominaria Besieged focuses on the actual invasion, as a big "hey, this is what it'd look like if New Phyrexia got their way!". This is the point where they hatch the mad plan to make their own sylex and travel back in time to see how it works (going back to BRO).
4) BRO happens. I liked BRO - it can stay the same.
5) ONE is the initial attempt to get the sylex to Phyrexia to blow stuff up. Assuming I can fiddle with the planeswalker line-up, they send in Elspeth (who meets up with Koth), Nissa and Vraska. This attempt to get the Sylex to the heart of Phyrexia fails, and the invasion force gets scattered. Elspeth escapes being compleated and gets back to Koth, while the other two get compleated (with compleated Nissa being the key to Realmbreaker working).
6) TWO is about Jace and Nahiri staging a rescue mission. Jace gets compleated by Vraska, but Nahiri meets up with Koth and Elspeth. Progress on Realmbreaker is mentioned and the possibility of the Sylex wrecking everything if it is comple(a)ted is discussed, but the decision is ultimately reached that they'd try to get the Sylex in position before it hits the "connect the multiverse" point.
Importantly, the planeswalkers are split here — Koth is adamant that no cost is too great to defeat Phyrexia, Nahiri is all "actually, I've recently learned that mass genocide is a bad thing — containment might be possible?", and Elspeth is on the fence. They get to the center of Phyrexia, see that Realmbreaker is activated... and Koth uses the Sylex anyway, while Nahiri tries to stop him. Elspeth grabs it and BAMFs away, leaving Nahiri alone and hopeless.
BOOM. IT'S MOM TIME. TIME FOR MOM.
...
The exact planeswalkers they send can vary (I'd definitely keep Elspeth, Jace, Koth, Nissa, and Vraska, if only because they cover the full
, but also because they have the most interesting story beats), but it honestly flows better if we don't end up with two planeswalker cycles in a set that really shouldn't be focused on the planeswalkers.This would also let them play with the factions on Phyrexia a bit more — ONE could be mostly just "here's the status quo", while TWO would be the set where Urabrask makes his bid to topple Elesh Norn.
EDIT: I cut the Emperor, Kaito, Lucca, and Tyvar because I'm not sure that there's a compelling reason for them to be in the set? We can stick the Emperor and Kaito back in one of the DMU sets, and Tyvar and Lucca can wait for MOM.
I've just learned that the legend reprints are like a bonus sheet, meaning we'll have one legend reprint in it's respective home plane's showcase treatment in every draft booster. That like the best news so far regarding this set, for me at least. It really makes drafting interesting (I loved it in Strixhaven and Brother's War) and means there are potentially a bunch of visual upgrades coming for cards people might be cubing
I meant more an updated magic with 4 or 6 colours. No sorceries, other improvements, and no phyrexians. In an alternate universe where Yawgmoth never existed.
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
Magic the Hard Reset ‘
I disagree that 4 or 6 colors or no sorceries would be improvements. I think 5 colors is the perfect, sweet spot of enough variation and not too many factions for drafting and mana bases. And sorceries are a valuable design tool; instead of getting rid of them, they should've make instant a supertype like two decades ago.
What would be the game design reason for splitting up Dominaria United and All Will Be One? Neither set felt like it really needed a continuation from a mechanical standpoint.Thinking about the current plotline a little more...
I think that it could've been more effective if DMU and ONE had been split into a pair of sets each. Let's call them, I dunno... Dominaria United/Dominaria Besieged and ONE/TWO (I can't think of a good name for the second ONE set, so sue me
1) Elspeth gets tipped off in alt!New Capenna that Sheoldred is planning on invading Dominaria (because that's what Daddy Yawgmoth would've wanted).
2) DMU is spent with a bunch of planeswalkers running around trying to get Dominaria ready. Sheoldred's in the set... and so is Ajani, Sleeper Agent! They've had a mole in their midst the whole time.
3) Dominaria Besieged focuses on the actual invasion, as a big "hey, this is what it'd look like if New Phyrexia got their way!". This is the point where they hatch the mad plan to make their own sylex and travel back in time to see how it works (going back to BRO).
4) BRO happens. I liked BRO - it can stay the same.
5) ONE is the initial attempt to get the sylex to Phyrexia to blow stuff up. Assuming I can fiddle with the planeswalker line-up, they send in Elspeth (who meets up with Koth), Nissa and Vraska. This attempt to get the Sylex to the heart of Phyrexia fails, and the invasion force gets scattered. Elspeth escapes being compleated and gets back to Koth, while the other two get compleated (with compleated Nissa being the key to Realmbreaker working).
6) TWO is about Jace and Nahiri staging a rescue mission. Jace gets compleated by Vraska, but Nahiri meets up with Koth and Elspeth. Progress on Realmbreaker is mentioned and the possibility of the Sylex wrecking everything if it is comple(a)ted is discussed, but the decision is ultimately reached that they'd try to get the Sylex in position before it hits the "connect the multiverse" point.
Importantly, the planeswalkers are split here — Koth is adamant that no cost is too great to defeat Phyrexia, Nahiri is all "actually, I've recently learned that mass genocide is a bad thing — containment might be possible?", and Elspeth is on the fence. They get to the center of Phyrexia, see that Realmbreaker is activated... and Koth uses the Sylex anyway, while Nahiri tries to stop him. Elspeth grabs it and BAMFs away, leaving Nahiri alone and hopeless.
BOOM. IT'S MOM TIME. TIME FOR MOM.
I agree the Phyrexian story is feeling rushed, but honestly, I think the biggest problem is that the "Invasion of the Multiverse" is being jammed into a single set. I'm not convinced adding extra sets on Dominaria or New Phyrexia would actually solve the story problem since both of those sets are still essentially setup.
I meant indeed the instant super type. The amount of colours I do not care about at all. The problem with some of the colours is that they are quite bland flavour/strength wise compared to the others or that a certain one has received all the goodies.
The more colours the harder it is to support them all in a cube. The fewer colours the blander it becomes.
landofMordor
Administrator
the six black pips really cracked me up
landofMordor
Administrator
about the team ups: i think it heckin rules, in the same way that a crossover comic cover rules. It's just cool and silly and cool.
that said, it's time for my quarterly reflection that magic has never been well written. I agree with @LadyMapi 's criticisms of the story, but also feel like the fundamental tension between story characters and game pieces can't be happily resolved. "I crew my helicopter with my dinosaur which is wearing a Short Sword, and then I'll attack my opponent the planeswalker, which causes my planeswalker brain to think new thoughts." It's just nonsense all the way down.
We've got cool and functinoal game pieces; we've got (a roughly good-faith attempt at) emotional story-telling on the free web fiction; we've got a story that doesn't hold up to scrutiny in the era of the MCU especially if you look at the cards too closely. I'd prefer if we had all 3, but I'm happy to sacrifice the latter for the sake of the former two.
that said, it's time for my quarterly reflection that magic has never been well written. I agree with @LadyMapi 's criticisms of the story, but also feel like the fundamental tension between story characters and game pieces can't be happily resolved. "I crew my helicopter with my dinosaur which is wearing a Short Sword, and then I'll attack my opponent the planeswalker, which causes my planeswalker brain to think new thoughts." It's just nonsense all the way down.
We've got cool and functinoal game pieces; we've got (a roughly good-faith attempt at) emotional story-telling on the free web fiction; we've got a story that doesn't hold up to scrutiny in the era of the MCU especially if you look at the cards too closely. I'd prefer if we had all 3, but I'm happy to sacrifice the latter for the sake of the former two.
I meant split up in a story sense, not a mechanical sense. I'm not suggesting that we'd have two sets in a row with identical mechanics (though that would be pretty nice, honestly — it'd give them more time to explore the design space around stuff like Corrupted or Enlist).
The reason why I think that sticking two sets in there would help is because it currently feels like they gave themselves 8 sets to set up Phyrexia as a multiversal threat, and spent those on:
1. Kaldheim - oh, hey, Phyrexians can use the planar bridge, and are interested in this tree for reasons.
2. Midnight Hunt - let's step back from the Phyrexia stuff, because we don't want to show our hand too quickly.
3. Crimson Vow - yep, still taking a break from Phyrexia! Maybe we should get back to that.
4. Neo Kamigawa - boom, money shot — Jin Gitaxias shows up, and we unveil the Phyrexian's new, terrifying trick: they can compleat planeswalkers! Tons of potential there for some subtle paranoia and mind-games.
5. Streets of the New Capenna - wait, did someone forget to tell the story team that Urabrask was supposed to be in this one? Oh well, we can stick him in in post. Also, boy howdy there's a lot of angels in this set where angels only show up at the end, story-wise!
6. Dominaria United - oh crap, we're starting to run up against the deadline. Quick, cram the Sheoldred arc into a single set! Oh, and I guess this is where we compleat Ajani?
7. Brother's War - Nostalgia bate + establishing the anti-Phyrexia super-weapon. Sounds good to me!
8. All Will Be One - wait, we forgot to show everyone what New Phyrexia looks like. Let's cram the revisit in with our final set-up. Oh crap, we had a whole list of planeswalkers that we wanted to compleat before the big show... eh, let's stick 'em in here, no-one will mind.
The culprits here are Capenna (which really should've showed that Halo protects you from the oil - they might've demonstrated that it worked on Urabrask in the web stories, but I'm a "if it isn't in the cards, then it basically doesn't exist" kinda guy when it comes to the lore, so whatever), Dominaria United (which spent a lot of the narrative momentum that had been built up in the previous sets, and worked against the threat set-up in Neo Kamigawa), and All Will Be One (which shoved WAY too much set-up into a tiny bag).
...
Alternate proposal to splitting up DMU:
1) Compleat Ob Nixilis before New Capenna happens.
2) Urabrask is on New Capenna because he's trying to warn people that hey, Phyrexians have their own planeswalkers now!
3) Ob Nixilis tries to compleat a bunch of mobsters, and fails utterly due to the Halo. He shrugs and goes with plan B of "eh, I'll conquer it the old fashioned way — I can do the compleating later".
4) Elspeth gets involved, and Our Heroes learn that Halo innoculates against the oil. Cool!
5) News of this development gets back to New Phyrexia, they go "shit, I guess the slow approach won't work if stuff like that's going to happen", and they go loud in DMU by sending Sheoldred.
6) DMU → BRO happens.
7) ONE + MOM are spread over three sets instead of two — "doomed last-minute attempt to stop the invasion", "the invasion begins!", and "the invasion happens everywhere all at once, but gets stopped by Our Plucky Heroes".
I call this the "boy howdy, they kinda botched New Capenna's story, didn't they?" approach.
The reason why I think that sticking two sets in there would help is because it currently feels like they gave themselves 8 sets to set up Phyrexia as a multiversal threat, and spent those on:
1. Kaldheim - oh, hey, Phyrexians can use the planar bridge, and are interested in this tree for reasons.
2. Midnight Hunt - let's step back from the Phyrexia stuff, because we don't want to show our hand too quickly.
3. Crimson Vow - yep, still taking a break from Phyrexia! Maybe we should get back to that.
4. Neo Kamigawa - boom, money shot — Jin Gitaxias shows up, and we unveil the Phyrexian's new, terrifying trick: they can compleat planeswalkers! Tons of potential there for some subtle paranoia and mind-games.
5. Streets of the New Capenna - wait, did someone forget to tell the story team that Urabrask was supposed to be in this one? Oh well, we can stick him in in post. Also, boy howdy there's a lot of angels in this set where angels only show up at the end, story-wise!
6. Dominaria United - oh crap, we're starting to run up against the deadline. Quick, cram the Sheoldred arc into a single set! Oh, and I guess this is where we compleat Ajani?
7. Brother's War - Nostalgia bate + establishing the anti-Phyrexia super-weapon. Sounds good to me!
8. All Will Be One - wait, we forgot to show everyone what New Phyrexia looks like. Let's cram the revisit in with our final set-up. Oh crap, we had a whole list of planeswalkers that we wanted to compleat before the big show... eh, let's stick 'em in here, no-one will mind.
The culprits here are Capenna (which really should've showed that Halo protects you from the oil - they might've demonstrated that it worked on Urabrask in the web stories, but I'm a "if it isn't in the cards, then it basically doesn't exist" kinda guy when it comes to the lore, so whatever), Dominaria United (which spent a lot of the narrative momentum that had been built up in the previous sets, and worked against the threat set-up in Neo Kamigawa), and All Will Be One (which shoved WAY too much set-up into a tiny bag).
...
Alternate proposal to splitting up DMU:
1) Compleat Ob Nixilis before New Capenna happens.
2) Urabrask is on New Capenna because he's trying to warn people that hey, Phyrexians have their own planeswalkers now!
3) Ob Nixilis tries to compleat a bunch of mobsters, and fails utterly due to the Halo. He shrugs and goes with plan B of "eh, I'll conquer it the old fashioned way — I can do the compleating later".
4) Elspeth gets involved, and Our Heroes learn that Halo innoculates against the oil. Cool!
5) News of this development gets back to New Phyrexia, they go "shit, I guess the slow approach won't work if stuff like that's going to happen", and they go loud in DMU by sending Sheoldred.
6) DMU → BRO happens.
7) ONE + MOM are spread over three sets instead of two — "doomed last-minute attempt to stop the invasion", "the invasion begins!", and "the invasion happens everywhere all at once, but gets stopped by Our Plucky Heroes".
I call this the "boy howdy, they kinda botched New Capenna's story, didn't they?" approach.
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Accepting the premise for a second that storytelling in mtg has always been bad and is inherently doomed to fail, they could just elect to then not focus on it, instead of shining a big spotlight on it. Lorwyn, Alara, Kamigawa, Innistrad, and whatever else are great sets that primarily focus on worldbuilding instead of setting up or resolving some world ending threat. I'd add Zendikar to the pile, but Eldrazi were a thing, and while I do really like them, channel fireball happened.
I don't dislike the unlikely pairs conceptually, but the examples shown largely fall into the camp of nonsensical and campy, I can't engage with them as real characters. Squee and Slimefoot works for me because they're both kind of adorable dorks, but I don't know how anyone find the time to establish rapport with the Gitrog Monster when you're under a zombie attack or what benefit Ghalta gets from his vampire accessory. You could instead have paired Mavren with one of the pirates, which is a much more powerful statement considering the history between the pirates and vampires.
also can I just say that it feels like such a waste to break one of the core established rules of phyrexia by compleating planeswalkers and then undermining the significance of it immediately by letting phyrexians be able to mass teleport entire armies anywhere they want.
I don't dislike the unlikely pairs conceptually, but the examples shown largely fall into the camp of nonsensical and campy, I can't engage with them as real characters. Squee and Slimefoot works for me because they're both kind of adorable dorks, but I don't know how anyone find the time to establish rapport with the Gitrog Monster when you're under a zombie attack or what benefit Ghalta gets from his vampire accessory. You could instead have paired Mavren with one of the pirates, which is a much more powerful statement considering the history between the pirates and vampires.
also can I just say that it feels like such a waste to break one of the core established rules of phyrexia by compleating planeswalkers and then undermining the significance of it immediately by letting phyrexians be able to mass teleport entire armies anywhere they want.
It seems to me Magic is deep into that "Comic book bullshit" where writers try to come up with even more cataclysmic, game-changing events they are unable to handle and all without actually killing characters or upsetting the status quo much.
Has Magic had time travel yet? Seems like it will come up sooner or later.
Has Magic had time travel yet? Seems like it will come up sooner or later.
Yes, it has had time travel. However, with the caveat that it could only go back a couple of hours. When pushing it Urza overloaded the Time Machine in urza’s legacy and created time rifts on Tolaria.
I think, but am not sure, these time rifts were part of the
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
I'm guessing none of you read the Brother's War story
No, not the original Brother's War story, the one accompanying the set that came out last year. One of the main plot points revolves around time travel, or a temporal anchor, as they call it. I linked to the final story, where Teferi does a bunch of time hopping and (spoiler warning!) ends up speaking with pre-planeswalker Urza. If you want to start at the beginning, here's all the links your need.
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Thanks for providing the link, but my previous attempts to engage with the MtG story have been frustrating: I’d rather spend my time reading better written books.
I find that I can pick up enough from the cards to have a vague idea of what is going on. Although my story may differ in some of the details, they are mostly unimportant.
There is one question I would like answered by someone better versed in lore: who is winning the New Phyrexia ratings war? Sheoldred’s gladiatorial combat, or Elesh Norn and her musical cabaret shows?
I find that I can pick up enough from the cards to have a vague idea of what is going on. Although my story may differ in some of the details, they are mostly unimportant.
There is one question I would like answered by someone better versed in lore: who is winning the New Phyrexia ratings war? Sheoldred’s gladiatorial combat, or Elesh Norn and her musical cabaret shows?
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
Deffo Elesh Norn, only ones she hasn't convinced are Urabrask's posse, but that's still at least an 80% approval rating!
Magic's had a lot of time travel. Teferi looks into the past in Brother's War, there's time rifts in Time Spiral (one of the sets are literally called future sight), I'm sure Teferi was up to some time-travel shenanigans during the original Dominaria story-line as well, and Fate Reforger is unironically Sarkhan retconning Tarkir.
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
I heard Teferi is the new Doctor Who
Teferi was not time travelling in visions. He phased whole continents out. Those continents could not interact anymore but it was not time travel. First time travel I am aware of is in urza’s saga block. Karn was made to time travel.
