Sets [OGW] Oath of the Gatewatch Spoiler Thread
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The prevalent theory is that <> can be spent as any color of mana to cast colorless spells. It's also worth noting that Wastes is a basic, but yields no type. Sorry domain.
Overall, I'm enthusiastic to see how they play with the new mana symbol and what that means for cube. Do we suit up new Waste basics for decks attempting to splash Kozilek and company? Or maybe this will lay a new foundation for a themed cube. Or maybe these are really good fakes. That could be the case too.
If these aren't masterful fakes, then I am a little disappointed that this is only showing up in a small set. A funky new basic land is outrageous and I would have loved to see it played around with more.
Overall, I'm enthusiastic to see how they play with the new mana symbol and what that means for cube. Do we suit up new Waste basics for decks attempting to splash Kozilek and company? Or maybe this will lay a new foundation for a themed cube. Or maybe these are really good fakes. That could be the case too.
If these aren't masterful fakes, then I am a little disappointed that this is only showing up in a small set. A funky new basic land is outrageous and I would have loved to see it played around with more.
I thought that they might be fake early when it was only two spoilers with Kozilek and the basic, but then the third image popped up from a different source. And that one looks like a pic taken with a camera. Then I went through the numbers, art, and wording and they all seem legit to me. I think these are the real deal.
Assuming so, holy shit Kozilek is so freaking cool. This is the kind of ramp target I'm perfectly fine with sticking at the high end of a deck as a payoff. He's also a sweet reanimation target without being completely oppressive (opponent needs to have the right discard cmc to protect it), can be interacted with and killed by so many removal spells (shoutout Tragic Slip), and he just FEELS like a Titan without being oppressive with annihilator. I love this card, I hope that it's real.
Mirrorpool is really cool as well, totally would stick into the ULD. I'm pretty sure that this symbol is a check for colorless mana, but I'm wondering how exactly it'll work. I'm assuming that the diamonds just check to make sure that you pay with colorless for it (which makes non-fixing lands more valuable), but then again that mythic land taps for diamond, not just colorless. Who knows. If there are more cards like these, that care about colorless mana, I'll probably be moving for cards from ULD into main in the near future.
Assuming so, holy shit Kozilek is so freaking cool. This is the kind of ramp target I'm perfectly fine with sticking at the high end of a deck as a payoff. He's also a sweet reanimation target without being completely oppressive (opponent needs to have the right discard cmc to protect it), can be interacted with and killed by so many removal spells (shoutout Tragic Slip), and he just FEELS like a Titan without being oppressive with annihilator. I love this card, I hope that it's real.
Mirrorpool is really cool as well, totally would stick into the ULD. I'm pretty sure that this symbol is a check for colorless mana, but I'm wondering how exactly it'll work. I'm assuming that the diamonds just check to make sure that you pay with colorless for it (which makes non-fixing lands more valuable), but then again that mythic land taps for diamond, not just colorless. Who knows. If there are more cards like these, that care about colorless mana, I'll probably be moving for cards from ULD into main in the near future.
Looking at the power level of Mirrorpool, it's a bit pushed but still realistic if you assume a cost of <> can be paid with any color and a <> mana pays for a cost of (1) or <>. It'd be a Fork/Clone land for any color with a markup of two mana 2, which is a bit less than the Blighted lands but still plausible, especially counting it's a mythic and CIPT. I think you got the mechanics right.
Edit: but if this is the mechanic... Wastes is useless. Yeah, that might be closer to a 6th mana color.
Edit: but if this is the mechanic... Wastes is useless. Yeah, that might be closer to a 6th mana color.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't one of the contestants on Next Great Designer Search come up with the exact same mechanic, and the Wizards people totally poo-poo'd it. I also remember there being a burn spell that could be paid for with only colorless, and they poo-poo'd it also, but then printed this card.
Dom Harvey
Contributor
>implying these are real as if Raymond Swanland could ever draw something with a rounded curve in it
>implying anything is real
>implying anything is real
Laz
Developer
I just had a look at the Wizards site for the official announcement of Oath of the Gatewatch, and that announcement artwork... I don't think I have ever been put off a set more.
PLANESWALKERS! WE HAVE PLANESWALKERS! THEY ARE ALL COMPLICATED INDIVIDUALS THAT YOU SHOULD CARE ABOUT! LOOK! THEY HAVE MAGIC!
I don't know if it is the palette, the masters of four elements trope, the fact that they seem to be simply firing rounds into the air, or what, but it just feels like the target audience was small children.
Also, I would forgive anyone for assuming the haughty green-lit she-elf was the villain here.
PLANESWALKERS! WE HAVE PLANESWALKERS! THEY ARE ALL COMPLICATED INDIVIDUALS THAT YOU SHOULD CARE ABOUT! LOOK! THEY HAVE MAGIC!
I don't know if it is the palette, the masters of four elements trope, the fact that they seem to be simply firing rounds into the air, or what, but it just feels like the target audience was small children.
Also, I would forgive anyone for assuming the haughty green-lit she-elf was the villain here.
I just had a look at the Wizards site for the official announcement of Oath of the Gatewatch, and that announcement artwork... I don't think I have ever been put off a set more.
PLANESWALKERS! WE HAVE PLANESWALKERS! THEY ARE ALL COMPLICATED INDIVIDUALS THAT YOU SHOULD CARE ABOUT! LOOK! THEY HAVE MAGIC!
I don't know if it is the palette, the masters of four elements trope, the fact that they seem to be simply firing rounds into the air, or what, but it just feels like the target audience was small children.
Also, I would forgive anyone for assuming the haughty green-lit she-elf was the villain here.
no, see, they're all throwing up horns for satan, it's cool again
Laz
Developer
Not everything... I am sure they will print some cards that I will love. They do have 184 chances to do so after all.
I'm curious how that countering ability will actually play out.
Check the wall over on the left of kozilek's channeler:
P.S. Kozilek's flavor text goes straight into the poop thread.
Check the wall over on the left of kozilek's channeler:
P.S. Kozilek's flavor text goes straight into the poop thread.
I'm curious how that countering ability will actually play out.
Check the wall over on the left of kozilek's channeler:
P.S. Kozilek's flavor text goes straight into the poop thread.
Jesus christ this is a horrible picture.
Excited for snow mana though.
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
The most likely speculation I have heard so far is that <> is the new symbol for colorless mana, meaning that a reprint of, for example, Academy Ruins would now read:
: Add <> to your mana pool., : Put target artifact card from your graveyard on top of your library.By putting a mana symbol on it they can split castings costs into generic mana and mana that has to be colorless (i.e.
vs. <>). This is actually quite exciting to me, because this is the explanation that best integrates the new Kozilek (and other cards that require <>) with existing cards. There are tons of cards that already produce colorless mana, and the prospect of new design space (artifacts that need colorless mana to be cast, for example) is awesome. Also, this would totally explain why reminder text isn't needed for these cards, which a theory like "you can spend this mana as any color on colorless cards" most likely would have needed. A symbol for colorless mana, that's so fricking elegant that it's crazy they didn't come up with it before! It just clicks, I'm excited!
I think the "any color on colorless cards" is not very plausible. Do they want limited 100% Devoid decks where people just have outrageously perfect mana? Considering it's a basic, I assume you can use any number of them? This would require shipping out a ton into the world, but they've done similar things before.
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
My guess is this will replace a common in each OGW booster, forcing you to draft them, much like snow lands in Coldsnap limited?
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
Don't you see though, it isn't a new color. That's the beauty of this! Colorless mana has always existed in Magic, going back to Channel in Alpha. They've just never done anything interesting with it. A set about colossal Eldrazi monsters that transcend the existing 'colored' notions about how mana works is the perfect spot to introduce this! A genius move that I hope will become evergreen!
Isn't this just barry's land, without a type? They were so focused on making it increase domain (since that was Barry's original, y'know, DEAL) that they let themselves get stonewalled by the most modern issues around Alara time. Even more recently, casual Commander players started crying about colorless EDH being too hard to play because lands were too hard to get. A few years later? Boom.
I don't think an errata to all previous cards that tap for generic mana is really feasible at this point- fireball princess tapping for <><><><> is gross, yo. My gut feeling is that it's just a gimmick for eldrazi/zendikar and we won't see it in every set from now on, but I wouldn't hate it being a permanent fixture.
I don't think an errata to all previous cards that tap for generic mana is really feasible at this point- fireball princess tapping for <><><><> is gross, yo. My gut feeling is that it's just a gimmick for eldrazi/zendikar and we won't see it in every set from now on, but I wouldn't hate it being a permanent fixture.
Keep in mind there aren't really "small" draft sets anymore going forward. They have more cards so that they're closer to being medium sized and now contribute two packs to their draft format instead of just one. It seems likely that second sets will or at least can branch away from their parent sets much more easily because of these facts.
Dom Harvey
Contributor
I hope these turn out to be the most hilariously overblown fake spoilers of all time
Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't one of the contestants on Next Great Designer Search come up with the exact same mechanic, and the Wizards people totally poo-poo'd it. I also remember there being a burn spell that could be paid for with only colorless, and they poo-poo'd it also, but then printed this card.
I read this the other day and I thought I had been linked from here, but apparently not. Here's the Great Designer Search entry where the competitor, Jon Loucks previously of Limited Resources, makes this exact mechanic almost five years ago and it is almost universally poorly received.
Comparison between Gut Shot and Darkfire (Shock for <>) is pretty spot on.
Laz
Developer
Were that the direction they wanted to take this, why would we only see it in set 2 of a 2-set block? Surely creation of a Basic Land, definition of a new type of mana, etc. are the kinds of mechanic that would have required a massive back and forth between rules, design and development that would definitely have occurred before BFZ went to print. Why then do Blighted Lands tap for ?
Eh, Colourless mana has the potential to be a more interesting mechanic than how clumsily I feel Devoid was randomly tacked on to things to pull off the 'totally not-tribal' Eldrazi mechanic. Lets see how this unfolds.
?Eh, Colourless mana has the potential to be a more interesting mechanic than how clumsily I feel Devoid was randomly tacked on to things to pull off the 'totally not-tribal' Eldrazi mechanic. Lets see how this unfolds.
Were that the direction they wanted to take this, why would we only see it in set 2 of a 2-set block? Surely creation of a Basic Land, definition of a new type of mana, etc. are the kinds of mechanic that would have required a massive back and forth between rules, design and development that would definitely have occurred before BFZ went to print. Why then do Blighted Lands tap for
Eh, Colourless mana has the potential to be a more interesting mechanic than how clumsily I feel Devoid was randomly tacked on to things to pull off the 'totally not-tribal' Eldrazi mechanic. Lets see how this unfolds.
Well, either way I wouldn't expect this new mana type to appear in other sets. Let's not forget that Phyrexian mana occurred in only the small set of a three-set block. I don't really expect this to be an evergreen mechanic either way. Maybe this is just a new type of mana that is never used again and doesn't retrofit with the rest of Magic history.