General [TMT] Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles
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I'm glad the card exists (mechanically). I loved Salt Road Packbeast in TDM retail (aside: I just realized why they didn't give the set the code TDS, which is on its face more sensible otherwise) and it's something I was looking to slot into my rather powerful Reject Cube recently. It's a good mechanic for white to have that's on-theme and has a lot of practical uses for communicating the types of decks supported in a limited format like Cube.
A card in a similar vein that got overlooked in the deluge of Final Fantasy cards recently is Cyan, Vengeful Samurai.
I don't think it needed the +1/+1 counter ability, but I guess it makes it feel less empty/gives it slightly more synergies in a Commander deck. I love graveyard mechanics so it's preferable for most of my projects, but it's clear Leonardo's power-level (literally) makes it a more thrilling inclusion into Cubes. That turtle hits like a truck!
A card in a similar vein that got overlooked in the deluge of Final Fantasy cards recently is Cyan, Vengeful Samurai.
I don't think it needed the +1/+1 counter ability, but I guess it makes it feel less empty/gives it slightly more synergies in a Commander deck. I love graveyard mechanics so it's preferable for most of my projects, but it's clear Leonardo's power-level (literally) makes it a more thrilling inclusion into Cubes. That turtle hits like a truck!
But that is my point exactly. Me and most of us don't want exactly that. I would prefer a format without "Rakdos is a cowboy now", "Sharks on motor cycles" and "Sherlock Holmes party on Ravnica" over a format that forbids Rally at the Hornburg or Hei Bai, Spirit of Balance.
I mean, I would also chose the reality where they only print sets like Ravnica: City of Guilds, Oddyssey, Innistrad, Khans or Shadowmoor. But given what we have to work with, I wouldn't want to exclude all UB per se from my cube or any format I play.
Chris Taylor
Contributor
Honestly between this and Splinter this set's theme in my eyes is quickly becoming "Oh dear that is ENORMOUS"I hadn't seen this one - from Commander deck, based on the symbol:
Not anything groundbreaking, but I don't think we've had that large a body on a creature with this ability (rather than convoke) before, let alone double strike.
I'm not sure its even too big or even problematically big but I'm getting the same kind of reaction from when I saw Agonasaur Rex
haha I'd already forgotten about him and he's really sweet too
Yeah, it feels like... definitely far too large to print ten years ago, but simultaneously, you need some kind of nutty Raise the Alarm -> Hop to It draw for it to actually be cheap enough to raise my eyebrows, and you can still chump it (though it's terrifying).
I've heard "rate monster", like, something that's just a really high pile of stats. Not necessarily a Baneslayer because it doesn't have abilities but just like a Gigantosaurus, you know?
Chris Taylor
Contributor
IMPORTANT NEWS EVERYONE:I hadn't seen this one - from Commander deck, based on the symbol:
Not anything groundbreaking, but I don't think we've had that large a body on a creature with this ability (rather than convoke) before, let alone double strike.
It's been kind of frustrating for me how unimpressive the big thicc creatures have been. I want my 8/8 for 5 to actually feel impactful, damnit!
looks like there's a couple people getting stuck with TMT promos in their Lorwyn kits. Some interesting designs:
Casey Jones, Vigilante seems very fun. Ideas Unbound is a pet card, and now I may be able to get it in my Cube in a form?
This is a dumb name, but I like everything it does mechanically.
Casey Jones, Vigilante seems very fun. Ideas Unbound is a pet card, and now I may be able to get it in my Cube in a form?
This is a dumb name, but I like everything it does mechanically.
More leaks, wow.
Chrome Dome This suits my Cube very well, and helps push this theme in a way that I like for 2 mana.
Leonardo's Technique seems like a great partner to a lot of the white reanimation we've had going on. Probably the 4th of the best 4, but that may be enough for a Cube as big as mine.
I just really like the design of this one, I don't think I'd actually play it.
Chrome Dome This suits my Cube very well, and helps push this theme in a way that I like for 2 mana.
Leonardo's Technique seems like a great partner to a lot of the white reanimation we've had going on. Probably the 4th of the best 4, but that may be enough for a Cube as big as mine.
I just really like the design of this one, I don't think I'd actually play it.
I really don't like these cards from an aesthetics point of view but naturally the ninja turtle artifact and discard themes would fit nicely with my cube..
I find these cards interesting:
This is a really cool card for green with an effect that we're much more likely to see on blue cards. It's also elegant in that the X makes X artifact tokens that double as +1/+1 counters and free sacrifice triggers. I hate intruducing another (bad) artifact token into my cube but the synergies with clue, blood, food might be too good to pass up.
I don't even know what I'm looking at (are those golf clubs..?) but this is basically a red cranial plating, something I might be interested in.
4 mana is a bit expensive for the ping effect but it's not capped per turn and triggers for each card. I kinda like it (from a design perspective). None of the levels are flavor text.
I can't read the mana cost on this one but my guess is 3 or 4? It might be too slow/finicky but in general I like this. It's a bit like mix between Throne of Geth and Culling Dais, narrow cards I've considered in the past.
Mechanically the set looks cool and I also have the feeling the power level is higher than lorwyn eclipsed, increasing the number of designs that fit into my cube from that perspective. I'm not looking forward to making universes within versions..
This does make me a bit sad though. I would have loved to include more cards from new Lorwyn but the mechanics were not great fits for my cube (vivid, 5 typal archetypes, blight (though I like that one!)). I would have loved to get my hands on some cool uncommon/rare evoke cards, the mythics unfortunately look a bit weak to me but maybe I'm undervaluing the (hard to use) flexibility. Also they're only true hybrids in lower power environments as one mode alone is not good enough in off color decks (in my cube).
I find these cards interesting:
This is a really cool card for green with an effect that we're much more likely to see on blue cards. It's also elegant in that the X makes X artifact tokens that double as +1/+1 counters and free sacrifice triggers. I hate intruducing another (bad) artifact token into my cube but the synergies with clue, blood, food might be too good to pass up.
I don't even know what I'm looking at (are those golf clubs..?) but this is basically a red cranial plating, something I might be interested in.
4 mana is a bit expensive for the ping effect but it's not capped per turn and triggers for each card. I kinda like it (from a design perspective). None of the levels are flavor text.
I can't read the mana cost on this one but my guess is 3 or 4? It might be too slow/finicky but in general I like this. It's a bit like mix between Throne of Geth and Culling Dais, narrow cards I've considered in the past.
Mechanically the set looks cool and I also have the feeling the power level is higher than lorwyn eclipsed, increasing the number of designs that fit into my cube from that perspective. I'm not looking forward to making universes within versions..
This does make me a bit sad though. I would have loved to include more cards from new Lorwyn but the mechanics were not great fits for my cube (vivid, 5 typal archetypes, blight (though I like that one!)). I would have loved to get my hands on some cool uncommon/rare evoke cards, the mythics unfortunately look a bit weak to me but maybe I'm undervaluing the (hard to use) flexibility. Also they're only true hybrids in lower power environments as one mode alone is not good enough in off color decks (in my cube).
I'm a sucker for Ninjutsu so I might be overvaluing this, but this looks like a fun card! Reminds me a lot of Archpriest of Shadows, but can be a lot more explosive the turn it comes down. Hitting your opponent's graveyard is interesting, and synergies well with Black playing a lot of discard and removal. The 4MV mode is nice if you have nothing to do that turn; First strike makes for a solid blocker, but you'll want to sneak this in most of the time. There's also a dream to be lived here with the new Twilight Diviner.
For me it might take the place of Orochi Soul-Reaver, which has a better floor but a lower ceiling. As ninja tribal gets more support though I'll likely just end up running both!
I will let this card absolutely murder me every time I play it. I can't resist saying no to that effect.
Goes nutty with Forensic Gadgeteer, since you can start sacrificing everything for free. Mutagen tokens look cool and I hope we get enough reasonable cards to support them. Splinter is another good one at least.
I also like hydra's with these 2 mana buyout modes if need be, ala The Goose Mother. Makes hitting them off a Shardless Agent feel a lot less worse.
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Agreed! Makes me think of Carnage Interpreter’s downside. This one can be blinked more easily and you can just sacrifice her before your upkeep.
This looks great. Mutagen tokens seem better than Map tokens IMO because of complexity reasons. Having artifacts to sacrifice rather than putting the counters straight up is pretty big since you can stockpile them and trigger cards like Ozolith, Shattered Spire multiple times.I find these cards interesting:
Extra rat text aside (which will probably be relevant sometimes ), this provides a steady stream of tokens and a growing threat. Seems super easy to trigger with a fetch on turn 2.
This is my kind of GY hate. One problematic card a turn so the GY strategy still has a chance. It comes with a nice upside making a huge amount of Mutagen tokens alongside Stonecoil Serpent and friends. Leave the battlefield is very open ended so drafters can trigger it however they want. It also gives you staying power in the face of removal.
Huge fan except for the turtles…
The delayed triggered ability still happens even if you sacrifice Casey before your next upkeep.
No cheating then, thanks for the clarification!
This set looks like a marked step up from Spider-Man! It still suffers slightly from the "there are a bunch of similar looking characters on legendary creatures" issue Spider-Man had, but not nearly to the same extent. I think the Villains are actively quite interesting: I know nothing about TMNT, so I thought all of the characters would just be random animal mutuants, but it turns out there are like, Aliens, Demons, Dinosaurs and more! I'm really loving these so far:
I had no idea the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles existed in the same universe as a Republican Empire of Anthropomorphized Spacefaring Triceratops, but I am delighted to know that they do!
Honestly, these Triceraton cards are making me wonder why in-multiverse Magic doesn't get awesome creative stuff like this (anymore?). It seems like the past few years have consisted primarily of genre adaptations or revisits. I would honestly like to visit whatever plane has the Magic equivalent of Triceratons instead of "detective party," "remember that thing you liked from 30 years ago? Here it is again but with worse art!," "legally distinct Redwall," or "return to a magical Liberal Arts college with a shitty nursing program." Give me magical Space Dinosaurs, dammit!
I had no idea the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles existed in the same universe as a Republican Empire of Anthropomorphized Spacefaring Triceratops, but I am delighted to know that they do!
Honestly, these Triceraton cards are making me wonder why in-multiverse Magic doesn't get awesome creative stuff like this (anymore?). It seems like the past few years have consisted primarily of genre adaptations or revisits. I would honestly like to visit whatever plane has the Magic equivalent of Triceratons instead of "detective party," "remember that thing you liked from 30 years ago? Here it is again but with worse art!," "legally distinct Redwall," or "return to a magical Liberal Arts college with a shitty nursing program." Give me magical Space Dinosaurs, dammit!
I actually am really liking this set. We've now seen every mythic and I think are likely to have seen every rare (we've gotten 50 compared to Spider-Man's 53, but I wouldn't be surprised if this is it), so I feel I'm almost ready to make my includes and testing list at this rate!!
I still don't like the turtle aesthetic and have zero nostalgia/interest in the franchise, but it's much more Magic-feeling than Spider-Man and doesn't conflict as much as I had feared. Like @TrainmasterGT said, a lot of the creatures are just dudes that look like they could be in any random set. I saw someone call it Kawabunga: Neon Dynasty and I don't think that's wholly unreasonable.
My favorite card so far? Rat King, Verminister
I think @Nanonox is right. It's interesting how similar this card is to Super Shredder and Moonshadow, the bonus of a 1/1 rat token more than making up for the the limit of only once per turn and only for our own permanents. In environment with fetches, Landscapes, and so many trinket artifacts, I think this is a pretty reliable token engine, and I love how it also can just turn into a reanimation spell if you happen to trigger it twice, since it's a rat itself. He also looks like a Magic card!
I see Super Shredder and I can't help but feel how pushed it is. But that's almost all it is. I see Rat King and I and feel like, if you can ignore the obvious Relentless Rats baiting the card is doing, it's such a dense and fun card to play with. It's an engine all on its own! I know many here reasonably don't like Engine+Payoff cards, and I'd be 90% as hyped for this card if it were just the engine part, but the payoff is reanimation (and requires you to throw away your engine) and it's finally a 2-drop creature that makes you work just enough for the reanimation bonus. It's something I've seriously been wanting for a long time, here's a list of those I've tried:
* Bonecaller Cleric is a little too anemic.
* Nullpriest of Oblivion, who should be in my Cube all the same, is a touch too expensive.
* Osteomancer Adept uses finality counters, which I'm only now just getting over.
* Reezug, the Bonecobbler is more limited in its outcome but most importantly is a fake card.
* Nezumi Graverobber is too slow for modern Magic cards and flip cards are annoying.
I really really like The Rat King and will probably play him instead of the more powerful Super Shredder due to the play patterns he supports. It's annoying though that previous rat tokens were unable to block, but I think I've taken out any cards that made those in the last few months (sadly).
Michelangelo, Weirdness to 11 is excellent. I love the +1/+1 counters support on a creature that benefits from it like Ozolith, the Shattered Spire, which has been very good for us. I've been really on the fence for actually playing Hardened Scales, which does nothing on its own, but there's enough +1/+1 stuff happening that it's felt weird I didn't. This gets it over the edge. I like the game pieces/trinkets support. The +1/+1 deck ends up playing plenty of tokens as it is, so it'll feel like a nice spot between a bunch of different archetypes, including the legendary creatures matter one.
That said, man, I don't love having two of my green 2-drops being Michelangelo, since I already feel pretty committed to Michelangelo, the Heart, even despite the irrelevant partner text and forced full-art (I wish they would put commander face cards with standard borders in CBs or something). They do work great together, though.
I adore Ravenous Robots, and again, doesn't even look UB. Pinnacle Emissary was interesting to me, but I didn't like it enough to take a UR slot, and at 3 mana, I felt I wanted the effect to come in earlier. Here we go! I can't wait to follow this up with a Mishra's Bauble or something. Giving tokens haste seems like a fun way to get some truly explosive turns. Only getting the tokens on cast is a good thing to stop a lot of shenanigans. The card isn't overly complicated, but it does a lot. Really excited for this one.
I'm right with @Nanonox on this. The Ooze is such a delightful card in every way so long as you're already playing Mutagens...except it has weird radioactive turtles on it.
Ajani's Pridemate meets The Destined White Mage/Aerith Gainsborough with ninjutsu.
I really want to make life gain matter, but the real key here is that I love the Sneak cost. If Spiderman taught me anything, it's that white really does love web-slinging mechanics, and getting your first hit safely using the Sneak ability makes you feel just smart enough. I like how this plays, and it makes me all the more interested in revisiting The Destined White Mage.
So here's the thing: I like Raphael, the Nightwatcher more than Sawhorn Nemesis. The double pip is a good thing to keep it in heavy red decks IMO, and double strike is generally just as good if not better than doubling the damage dealt. Losing that extra toughness is a big issue but being able to sneak it in is really powerful and fun on an effect like this. I saw complaints on Reddit that it's a win-more card or not as good as the 3-drops in Vintage Cube, and those things are both reasonable to say, but I think this compares favorably to Hellrider and other 4-drops, and there's very little in the Magic world that's as good as red's best 3's in Vintage lists.
I just tossed back in Karlach, Fury of Avernus on a lark but Raph & Leo, Sibling Rivals reminds me how powerful this kind of effect can be at lower MV. I don't think I want it for my Cube, but I do like what it's doing, and think it fits rather well in the median non-powered Cube as a flexible threat.
I was interested Technodrome prior to seeing its mana cost, but having it confirmed at
really gets me going. It's a construct if I want to put Scrapyard Recombiner back in, which it pairs very nicely with, but mostly, this is a way to maximize value of my many repeating token makers in the trinket deck. I wish it turned into a creature at 3 counters instead of being one that can't attack or block to start for the purposes of blowing up my food for value the turn it enters, but this is a compelling inclusion all the same.
I'd been looking at Chronomancer and this just seems better, both for not costing colored mana and for not requiring a payment each card draw. That said, I do love the unearth on the Necron...maybe I'll add both!
I feel like the Cube community is so mad about UB that they're ignoring seriously cool designs. I don't mind the throat clearing that myself and others do, but I also feel like the dislike of the aesthetic is drowning out so much of the conversation. I actively don't like Ninja Turtles. I do wish this was a UW set instead. But these designs are really cool, and I wish more people would engage with these from a Melvin POV if nothing else!
And like @TrainmasterGT said, there's some cool weirdness going on here that I miss from a more adventurous in-universe Magic. Technodrome seems just as much at home in Magic as Carrot Cake or Boom Box, doesn't it?
I still don't like the turtle aesthetic and have zero nostalgia/interest in the franchise, but it's much more Magic-feeling than Spider-Man and doesn't conflict as much as I had feared. Like @TrainmasterGT said, a lot of the creatures are just dudes that look like they could be in any random set. I saw someone call it Kawabunga: Neon Dynasty and I don't think that's wholly unreasonable.
My favorite card so far? Rat King, Verminister
I think @Nanonox is right. It's interesting how similar this card is to Super Shredder and Moonshadow, the bonus of a 1/1 rat token more than making up for the the limit of only once per turn and only for our own permanents. In environment with fetches, Landscapes, and so many trinket artifacts, I think this is a pretty reliable token engine, and I love how it also can just turn into a reanimation spell if you happen to trigger it twice, since it's a rat itself. He also looks like a Magic card!
I see Super Shredder and I can't help but feel how pushed it is. But that's almost all it is. I see Rat King and I and feel like, if you can ignore the obvious Relentless Rats baiting the card is doing, it's such a dense and fun card to play with. It's an engine all on its own! I know many here reasonably don't like Engine+Payoff cards, and I'd be 90% as hyped for this card if it were just the engine part, but the payoff is reanimation (and requires you to throw away your engine) and it's finally a 2-drop creature that makes you work just enough for the reanimation bonus. It's something I've seriously been wanting for a long time, here's a list of those I've tried:
* Bonecaller Cleric is a little too anemic.
* Nullpriest of Oblivion, who should be in my Cube all the same, is a touch too expensive.
* Osteomancer Adept uses finality counters, which I'm only now just getting over.
* Reezug, the Bonecobbler is more limited in its outcome but most importantly is a fake card.
* Nezumi Graverobber is too slow for modern Magic cards and flip cards are annoying.
I really really like The Rat King and will probably play him instead of the more powerful Super Shredder due to the play patterns he supports. It's annoying though that previous rat tokens were unable to block, but I think I've taken out any cards that made those in the last few months (sadly).
Michelangelo, Weirdness to 11 is excellent. I love the +1/+1 counters support on a creature that benefits from it like Ozolith, the Shattered Spire, which has been very good for us. I've been really on the fence for actually playing Hardened Scales, which does nothing on its own, but there's enough +1/+1 stuff happening that it's felt weird I didn't. This gets it over the edge. I like the game pieces/trinkets support. The +1/+1 deck ends up playing plenty of tokens as it is, so it'll feel like a nice spot between a bunch of different archetypes, including the legendary creatures matter one.
That said, man, I don't love having two of my green 2-drops being Michelangelo, since I already feel pretty committed to Michelangelo, the Heart, even despite the irrelevant partner text and forced full-art (I wish they would put commander face cards with standard borders in CBs or something). They do work great together, though.
I adore Ravenous Robots, and again, doesn't even look UB. Pinnacle Emissary was interesting to me, but I didn't like it enough to take a UR slot, and at 3 mana, I felt I wanted the effect to come in earlier. Here we go! I can't wait to follow this up with a Mishra's Bauble or something. Giving tokens haste seems like a fun way to get some truly explosive turns. Only getting the tokens on cast is a good thing to stop a lot of shenanigans. The card isn't overly complicated, but it does a lot. Really excited for this one.
I'm right with @Nanonox on this. The Ooze is such a delightful card in every way so long as you're already playing Mutagens...except it has weird radioactive turtles on it.
Ajani's Pridemate meets The Destined White Mage/Aerith Gainsborough with ninjutsu.
I really want to make life gain matter, but the real key here is that I love the Sneak cost. If Spiderman taught me anything, it's that white really does love web-slinging mechanics, and getting your first hit safely using the Sneak ability makes you feel just smart enough. I like how this plays, and it makes me all the more interested in revisiting The Destined White Mage.
So here's the thing: I like Raphael, the Nightwatcher more than Sawhorn Nemesis. The double pip is a good thing to keep it in heavy red decks IMO, and double strike is generally just as good if not better than doubling the damage dealt. Losing that extra toughness is a big issue but being able to sneak it in is really powerful and fun on an effect like this. I saw complaints on Reddit that it's a win-more card or not as good as the 3-drops in Vintage Cube, and those things are both reasonable to say, but I think this compares favorably to Hellrider and other 4-drops, and there's very little in the Magic world that's as good as red's best 3's in Vintage lists.
I just tossed back in Karlach, Fury of Avernus on a lark but Raph & Leo, Sibling Rivals reminds me how powerful this kind of effect can be at lower MV. I don't think I want it for my Cube, but I do like what it's doing, and think it fits rather well in the median non-powered Cube as a flexible threat.
I was interested Technodrome prior to seeing its mana cost, but having it confirmed at
really gets me going. It's a construct if I want to put Scrapyard Recombiner back in, which it pairs very nicely with, but mostly, this is a way to maximize value of my many repeating token makers in the trinket deck. I wish it turned into a creature at 3 counters instead of being one that can't attack or block to start for the purposes of blowing up my food for value the turn it enters, but this is a compelling inclusion all the same.I'd been looking at Chronomancer and this just seems better, both for not costing colored mana and for not requiring a payment each card draw. That said, I do love the unearth on the Necron...maybe I'll add both!
I feel like the Cube community is so mad about UB that they're ignoring seriously cool designs. I don't mind the throat clearing that myself and others do, but I also feel like the dislike of the aesthetic is drowning out so much of the conversation. I actively don't like Ninja Turtles. I do wish this was a UW set instead. But these designs are really cool, and I wish more people would engage with these from a Melvin POV if nothing else!
And like @TrainmasterGT said, there's some cool weirdness going on here that I miss from a more adventurous in-universe Magic. Technodrome seems just as much at home in Magic as Carrot Cake or Boom Box, doesn't it?