General Breaking Singleton

[Onderzeeboot]

All of those guys listed by Eric are way better than Manic vandal because they all hit both enchantments and artifacts and most of them are flexible in when you use that ability.

But none of them are red. there's nothing more I can add to that really. Of course Reclamation Sage is a million times better than Manic Vandal (disregarding human synergies an opposing pingers). That's all irrelevant though if you want your Grixis decks to be able to deal with artifacts as well. I would love for Wizards to print something in mono red closer to Reclamation Sage's power level, because, yes, Manic Vandal is not the best card in the world. It's still filling a hole though, and doing, in my cube at least, an admirable job. Good enough in fact, that I haven't thought of adding a custom card in its place.

 

[ahadabans]

That's all irrelevant though if you want your Grixis decks to be able to deal with artifacts as well.

That's what Thoughtseize and Counterspell are for.

 

[Onderzeeboot]

That's what Thoughtseize and Counterspell are for.

Those are both in my cube as well yes

Edit: I'm actually running this bad boy:



...which clearly falls in the "Eh. It's removal. I'll take it."-camp.

 

[shamizy]

I don't like Relic at all. It either goes 13th-15th and randomly hoses people, or the drafter who is heavily invested in the graveyard hates it out as a mid-pick. Deathrite, Scavenging Ooze and 2/1 Human Woe-rrior are much more palatable graveyard hate.

Totally forgot that I had added double Woe Reaper recently in place of double Solider of the Pantheon. With that alongside all the exile cards, that seems like more than enough main-deckable grave hate. Time to look into artifacts that don't suck.

 

[Diakonov]

But none of them are red. there's nothing more I can add to that really. Of course Reclamation Sage is a million times better than Manic Vandal (disregarding human synergies an opposing pingers). That's all irrelevant though if you want your Grixis decks to be able to deal with artifacts as well. I would love for Wizards to print something in mono red closer to Reclamation Sage's power level, because, yes, Manic Vandal is not the best card in the world. It's still filling a hole though, and doing, in my cube at least, an admirable job. Good enough in fact, that I haven't thought of adding a custom card in its place.

I cut Manic Vandal & friends a while ago, and I do agree that it would be nice for red to have a stronger card that deals with artifacts. Hopefully Wizards will do something about that in the not too distant future. In the meantime, what are our options?

 

[ahadabans]

Pillage is the only decent one.

Honestly, I've removed artifact destruction from red entirely. You want that, splash green or white. I've tried to address this by removing most broken artifacts from my cube. There really is no artifact mono red should auto lose too, except maybe a sword. So yeah I probably just need to drop the last one and be done with it.

 

[Suicufnoc]

Yeah artifact destruction isn't great when you can't count on your opponent to at least have a mox. One of the many, many advantages of powered cubes.

 

[Eric Chan]

You can do what I do: run only bad artifacts! Then you can cut all of the Torch Fiends and Manic Vandals of the world. It got to the point where people were complaining that Stoneforge Mystic was essentially worthless, with really only the two Bonesplitters as valuable targets. So I cut her, too.

 

[Suicufnoc]

Yeah that's where I'm at right now. I certainly wouldn't call bonesplitter bad, but I don't run any busted artifacts. Though I am running Isochron Scepter, which is sometimes really powerful, if super swingy. That's probably the most must-kill artifact I run.

 

[ahadabans]

You can do what I do: run only bad artifacts! Then you can cut all of the Torch Fiends and Manic Vandals of the world. It got to the point where people were complaining that Stoneforge Mystic was essentially worthless, with really only the two Bonesplitters as valuable targets. So I cut her, too.

This. I cut stoneforge awhile ago for this reason. When you don't have the full suite of swords, Jitte and clamp to fetch she loses a ton of value.

 

[CML]

i don't think there's a fun way to balance Stoneforge in Cube (I've tried everything).

Duergar Hedge-Mage seems like it should work because, after all, it is Reclamation Sage, isn't it? Yet everyone tells me to cut it every time we Cube. Am I going crazy or should I just decapitate it?

 

[shamizy]

Stoneforge is pretty shitty if you don't have something dumb to tutor up. Cut it a long time ago.

 

[Onderzeeboot]

I run Manic Vandal, Pillage, Goblin Welder (uh, kinda counts sometimes?) and this (sorry for the size, you're free to print it out and use it yourself though )



Manic Vandal is certainly replacable if they print something better, and Drown in Lava is also a placeholder until Wizards prints something decent in that slot (i.e. a direct damage / artifact destruction modal spell).

 

[Chris Taylor]

I love bodies that double as incidental hate cards, like Qasali Pridemage, Wickerbough Elder, and Acidic Slime. What's missing is some sorta Reclamation Sage in mono-white. There's Leonin Relic-Warder and Kor Sanctifiers, but I kinda hate both of them.

Eric!
Ronom Unicorn is to X as Viridian Shaman is to Reclamation Sage! This needs to happen wizards!

What sucks about most of the incedental naturalize guys is they're all green/white, and as abadans said there's no red/black creatures that are anywhere near as flexible.

Yeah, my cube is probably designed so that Seal of Cleansing is maindeckable. Not because there's must-kill enchantments or artifacts, but because almost every deck will pick up playable ones, so there will often be targets in your opponent's deck. Plummet isn't in my cube, but it is a card I wouldn't mind drafting if I was in green. It is after all an efficient and solid removal spell versus the right decks. I also like that it isn't crippling hate, like CoP: Red (or Swords of X and Y).

This has happened less and less in my cube since theros is not the current standard block so all my custom shit doesn't have bestow on it for basically no reason, but I loved when reclamation sage in my cube had about a 30% chance of being able to pick off a creature.

 

[Chris Taylor]

i don't think there's a fun way to balance Stoneforge in Cube (I've tried everything).

Duergar Hedge-Mage seems like it should work because, after all, it is Reclamation Sage, isn't it? Yet everyone tells me to cut it every time we Cube. Am I going crazy or should I just decapitate it?

I think the problem with him is that he gets worse as your mana gets better. Maybe that's better if all the nonbasics are shocklands?
No, funsies draft is still making him shit.

 

[ahadabans]

I think the Hedge-Mage is just a bad card. If I'm splashing white, I have access to way better options. If I'm mono-red, he is a RR1 Manic Vandal essentially (yeah, I guess he has the MAY clause, so slightly better but still pretty bogus).

The only upside is if you can three for one with him triggering both halves. And if that happens, yeah he's good. But I need two mountains and two plains, so he's more like a turn 5 play. And on turn 5, I'd rather play something else typically. Oh, AND my opponent needs both an artifact and enchantment in play. I just can't imagine that happens often.

 

[Onderzeeboot]

After the last update, these are the cards I'm breaking singleton for (all of them are in the cube twice, except for Brainstorm, of which I cube three copies).


And the other four color pairings for those last two lands.

 

[Jason Waddell]

Too bad Pridemate isn't a Cat Warrior.

 

[Chris Taylor]

Too bad Pridemate isn't a Cat Warrior.

Mirri Cat Warrior counts as a cat warrior though

 

[Jason Waddell]

Thanks for the relevant contribution.

 

[Eric Chan]

I know that incorporating custom cards is a big line most of us aren't willing to cross - myself included - but after experimenting with a human Amrou Scout, I'm becoming more and more comfortable with the idea of creature type errata. It feels like a smaller step than full blown custom cards created from scratch, and doesn't set off as many alarms with my player base. I'm not sure if I'm willing to take the next step yet, but some kind of vampire/zombie crossover could be the next logical thing to try. Or some kind of goblin tribal theme, like what FSR is doing.

 

[Chris Taylor]

I know that incorporating custom cards is a big line most of us aren't willing to cross - myself included - but after experimenting with a human Amrou Scout, I'm becoming more and more comfortable with the idea of creature type errata. It feels like a smaller step than full blown custom cards created from scratch, and doesn't set off as many alarms with my player base. I'm not sure if I'm willing to take the next step yet, but some kind of vampire/zombie crossover could be the next logical thing to try. Or some kind of goblin tribal theme, like what FSR is doing.

Another easy one is adjusting costs by a small amount of colorless. Addle for is probably less work than human amrou scout

 

[FlowerSunRain]

Ironically, with the goblins the issue was custom "buffing" about three goblins to get the critical mass. I'd imagine, however, you could instead creature type errata a few other cards to get a similar effect.

 

[Chris Taylor]

hey eric: Is it time for kitkikin cube?

 

[Eric Chan]

I always thought one day I'd get around to sharpie-ing Kithkin on every white weenie in my list, but Innistrad's introduction of human tribal has more than sated my tastes for the time being, especially because the support naturally bleeds into all five colours. I've always wondered if a human Wizened Cenn might be fun, but because that's both linear and hard to cast, I'm holding off on that for now.

FSR, what does your goblin tribe look like, including your buffed cards? For some reason, I have an unnatural attachment to Goblin Grenade, and want to get to the point where that's cubeable.