Sets [C15] Commander 2015 Spoiler Thread

Onderzeeboot

Ecstatic Orb
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Now that's a constellation card I can get behind!

Enchantment
Constellation - Whenever ~ or another enchantment enters the battlefield under your control, ~ becomes an 5/5 demon with flying and haste until end of turn in addition to it's other types.

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This is also pretty cute! Has to be in the {B/G} deck, right?
 
Wow that enchantment is pretty nuts. I can't really tell if it's too good or no. You could easily get stranded with no enchantments, but considering how much aura removal and general utility we already run. I guess you can always pick it off whenever your opponent trigger constellation if you're like the black red deck?
 

Kirblinx

Developer
Staff member
635822866694730468.png

Now that's a constellation card I can get behind!

Enchantment
Constellation - Whenever ~ or another enchantment enters the battlefield under your control, ~ becomes an 5/5 demon with flying and haste until end of turn in addition to it's other types.


Geez, how come Black gets a 5/5 hastey dragon demon for 4 mana? It even dodges sorcery speed removal? The red mage inside me is crying a little on the inside. I guess the closest comparisons are Archwing Dragon and Thundermaw Hellkite. I suppose it needs a little support... But still...
 
Wow, there is love for everyone!
This Commander set has a card for most Riptide themes. I love it!

...and that Karlov guy kinda makes me want to revisit lifegain as an archetype. It is nice flavor-wise, too, in that you can see that he and Teysa are related. They both read:

When X happens, do Y.
Pay 3-times-Y: exile target creature.

You can definitely see that blood is thicker than water!
 

Onderzeeboot

Ecstatic Orb
That's... a lot of life for five mana :confused:

Edit: 6/6 vigilance across multiple bodies is nothing to sneeze at either at that cost. This is a pretty wild card.
 

FlowerSunRain

Contributor
Some of these cards are so insanely pushed, I don't know how I feel about it. Like, I really wanted another black constellation card, but I'm not sure 5/5 flying haste is really where I want to be on that front. The confluences just do so much and have so much utility, I don't think I'd want to play them either even though flexible cards like that really help my cube as it runs lots of narrow cards (so broad cards like that are both wanted by lots of players and take care of a lot of roles the narrow cards don't). I'm a little down on this set so far, but that said I do love Ambush Cat, Zombie Dragon, Alphastrike Goat and the Thrinax. Maybe Karlov, I'm already running like 27 BW bears so that's kinda annoying.
 
Righteous Confluence looks very good, but I don't think it's broken. The blue one, though... and here I thought the red confluence was good.

Karlov is great - life gain needs more non-poisonous payoff like him, there are plenty of enablers.
 

FlowerSunRain

Contributor
Unless you regularly generate 6 +1/+1 counters on a single creature and can afford to throw them out, Karlov is just as poisonous as Ajani's Pridemate. He's just more pushed at the cost of going in fewer decks.

Pridemate decks regularly get him to 6/6-8/8 which would bring Karlov to 10/10-14/14 that can toss out 1-2 unmakes. The decision, I think, is deciding if you want a card that is poisonous, but extremely pushed in a specific deck. I can see good arguments on both sides of the issue. If your good stuff is really good, then bomby cards help niche archetypes compete. If your good stuff is less good, niche archetypes are already strong and deciding games by bombiness is less appealing.
 
I am living for these Confluences.

The blue one looks perfect for my format, which is all about a tight curve centered around low-cost spells and creatures.
- Mana Leak by T5 has the potential to fizzle if you don't wait for the right moment here, so double Leak, draw a card for 5 is a fair meh-case scenario compared to Cryptic Command.
- Single Leak, double draw is impressive, of course, but that's living the dream and works most often in Control versus Midrange. I'm okay with this, because it helps push aggro competitively (which has the best chance of getting under this card) and provide control another tool against Value Midrange, which I try to discourage as much as possible.
- Alternative mode of triple Leak is the worst-case scenario, but again, a late-game possibility that I'm not ruling out.
- Triple draw is the fairest and least desirable, because Jace's Ingenuity was always so much worse than Opportunity.
- Bounce, counter, draw will be potentially super powerful, I won't deny that. But leaving up so much mana? That's kind of rough, and I can see it being played around after round one. Since we typically do over a dozen rounds (remember I draft with 1 or 2 other people usually, and we play tons of games before re-drafting), I think that'll be fine enough.
- Bounce, bounce, draw, as well as bounce, bounce, bounce, are all, of course, super fucking frustrating/punishing options. My defense of this is that I want to see it in action before I agonize over it. Triple bounce is pretty mean, but it does give blue a way to blow through blockers in a more offensive shell, which is a strategy I already allow in other colours, so giving it to blue in another card seems fine. Then there's ETB effects that you might be re-buying for your opponent if you can't alpha in, and also, your alpha strike may be screwed by a piece of removal in response.
IDK, it looks super pushed, I give you that, but since it's just Leak and not full-up Counterspell, I'm definitely game to try it in my tighter format.

Righteous Confluence plays nicely into tokens and life gain over here, and I like that it provides another enchantment hate tool. The fact that it's sorcery helps keep it fair enough to play for me.

Fiery Confluence looks ballin and I see no reason to worry about it personally, it's a flexible bad Anger of the Gods, a flexible good Lava Axe, and a flexible good Manic Vandal that I don't feel guilty throwing into my cube. IDK, I'm happy with this.
 
One life trigger makes Karlov a 4/4 2-drop. You don't need it 12/12 to be worth it, it costs 2 mana. The exile ability is icing.

Yeah, it's meh without any lifegain, but with some lifelink and incidental life gain (which is centered in WB anyway) in your list, it'll be playable is most WB decks and bonkers in the lifegain deck. Poisonous cards are unplayable outside their archetype, and the mere presence of the archetype in your cube should create enough incidental payoff for it.
 

FlowerSunRain

Contributor
I think my point was missed here. Karlov is exactly as poisonous as Ajani's Pridemate. They have the same base stats and trigger the same way. A 2 mana 3/3 is completely playable. This is completely a question of degree: if Pridemate is completely playable, do we want the better version because it pushes the archetype or do we avoid it oversells the niche?
 

Grillo_Parlante

Contributor
Karlov looks great. Orzhov has a lot of uninspiring gold options, and this is an aggressive, low CC option met for an aristocrats package. I also like that it gives black decks something to do on turn 2 (that can block) which is something the color badly needs more of. Plus I like how it fits into the counters theme.

Pridemates problem was that it was a niche white 2 drop in a format that wasn't really about niche strategies, and introduced as part of a theme, rather than a deck. I don't think it should be too difficult to give karlov a home.

As much as I was not a fan of BFZ, this feels like a renaissance of sorts for the B/W/x aristocrat decks.
 
Karlov is very tempting.

Blue confluence is really good obviously. I am not as in love with the red one because I don't have walkers (so dome burn is not as good in my meta) and my artifact suite is as low powered as it's ever been.
 

FlowerSunRain

Contributor
Karlov is really strong, I'm pondering the card pretty hard. Pridemate driven decks have 2-1'd a couple of times and are pretty fun, but they are probably a little weak in the grand scheme of things and could use a nudge. Still, I don't think the 2 drop is where the deck needs more power. The 2 drop spot in that deck is lousy with great cards, making a good card in that deck even better is missing the point. However, high power cubes where pridemates are too weak should love the guy.
 
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