General Custom Cards: The Lab

Velrun

Velrun

Yeah both ward and menace are good keywords for this type of card.

Menace gives it pseudo annihilator 2.
Ward gives you your money back if it doesn’t work.
 
Zoss

Zoss

Rusje said:
If you can make it big, the opponent has likely not got any removal left.
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I don't think that's quite accurate, as the use case for Thromok is mainly in board stalls. You don't want to drop the Wurm when you're behind, as you need multiple blockers (this is all assuming that both decks play to the board, but I think that's a safe assumption for us here). You don't want to sac four creatures when you're ahead as you're putting all of your eggs in one basket and opening yourself up to turning on any single-target removal they might have that's ineffective against a wider board state. Really, where the Wurm shines is board stalls that you need to crack open, and as part of the definition of a board stall your opponent will have plenty of creatures to deal with a big trampler.

Another thought is this: what creatures are you sacrificing to Thromok? If it's a pile of 1/1 Goblin tokens you're probably fine trading it for a removal spell, but if it's a Tireless Provisioner, a Rabbit Battery, a Voyaging Satyr, and a Vengevine, then you really need to get value out of it otherwise that removal is a huge blowout.
 
Modin

Modin

How about
RGX
Menace
Devour X
When ~ dies drsw cards equal to half the +1/+1 counters on ~ rounded down.

It does sadly not work with the original wording :(

Maybe give it devour x+1?
 
Rusje

Rusje

Zoss said:
I don't think that's quite accurate, as the use case for Thromok is mainly in board stalls. You don't want to drop the Wurm when you're behind, as you need multiple blockers (this is all assuming that both decks play to the board, but I think that's a safe assumption for us here). You don't want to sac four creatures when you're ahead as you're putting all of your eggs in one basket and opening yourself up to turning on any single-target removal they might have that's ineffective against a wider board state. Really, where the Wurm shines is board stalls that you need to crack open, and as part of the definition of a board stall your opponent will have plenty of creatures to deal with a big trampler.

Another thought is this: what creatures are you sacrificing to Thromok? If it's a pile of 1/1 Goblin tokens you're probably fine trading it for a removal spell, but if it's a Tireless Provisioner, a Rabbit Battery, a Voyaging Satyr, and a Vengevine, then you really need to get value out of it otherwise that removal is a huge blowout.
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Not the board stalls I have encountered. It is rarely that one player has removal left since it is used against utility or evasive creatures. Furthermore, a trampler is quite hard to deal with, so a 36/36 trample is often a must answer or die in one or 2 turns.
My cube has phyrexian processor. The difference to a 7/7 without trample and one with is huge. Often trample is more difficult to handle than menace for the opponent (if the creatures of the opponent are relatively small).
 
kryss

kryss

At least in my cube, where thromok would be played mainly in sacrifice decks, a 5 mana 16/16 hexproof trample that only requires sacrificing a bunch of 1/1s or 0/1s would be probably too broken. I like the ward alternative tho, even more if it's something flavourful like "Ward - Sacrifice a creature".
 
Velrun

Velrun

@Chris Taylor

Have you thought about some of the existing Magic cards as scrolls instead?
Just a thought.

The scroll Hunt could be Prey Upon if you'd be okay with losing instant speed.
The scroll Growth could be Battlegrowth if you'd be okay with it gaining instant speed.
The scroll Growth could be Burst of Strength or Stony Strength if you also want to untap the creature.
The scroll Surge could be Maximize Altitude if you'd be okay with the spell gaining Jump-start.
 
Chris Taylor

Chris Taylor

Contributor
Velrun said:
@Chris Taylor

Have you thought about some of the existing Magic cards as scrolls instead?
Just a thought.

The scroll Hunt could be Prey Upon if you'd be okay with losing instant speed.
The scroll Growth could be Battlegrowth if you'd be okay with it gaining instant speed.
The scroll Growth could be Burst of Strength or Stony Strength if you also want to untap the creature.
The scroll Surge could be Maximize Altitude if you'd be okay with the spell gaining Jump-start.
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Interesting. They'd still be distinguishable as game objects because they'd be in different sleeves.
I don't think there's an exact match to what hunt does since Master's Rebuke is an instant and Devouring Tendrils gains life, but I see what you're getting at.

I don't love that I'd mostly be using lesser known cards (In part because I want scrolls to be such small effects, there just isn't usually a reason for something like Scorching Spear to exist)

Definitely something to keep in mind, but I think for now I want to keep them in.

I wonder if there is a level of ubiquity where I'd be comfortable not explaining the scroll's rules text? I'm not sure there is, given the complexity I've got to budget for.

AH fuck I forgot a period at the end of hunt's rules text ><
Edit: oh god and naturalize/regrowth as well
 
Rusje

Rusje

Chris Taylor said:
Interesting. They'd still be distinguishable as game objects because they'd be in different sleeves.
I don't think there's an exact match to what hunt does since Master's Rebuke is an instant and Devouring Tendrils gains life, but I see what you're getting at.

I don't love that I'd mostly be using lesser known cards (In part because I want scrolls to be such small effects, there just isn't usually a reason for something like Scorching Spear to exist)

Definitely something to keep in mind, but I think for now I want to keep them in.

I wonder if there is a level of ubiquity where I'd be comfortable not explaining the scroll's rules text? I'm not sure there is, given the complexity I've got to budget for.

AH fuck I forgot a period at the end of hunt's rules text ><
Edit: oh god and naturalize/regrowth as well
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Do you really want them in different sleeves? Seems weird with conjure into your library or brainstorm type of effects.
 
Jason Waddell

Jason Waddell

Administrator
Staff member
I don't know if it's all the reminder text or not, but some of these seem very wordy for custom cards. Is there a more elegant way to integrate green prowess?
 
Onderzeeboot

Onderzeeboot

Ecstatic Orb
Rusje said:
Do you really want them in different sleeves? Seems weird with conjure into your library or brainstorm type of effects.
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Yes, because they live in the command zone, they don't go into your hand. They're basically spell tokens, that cease to exist as soon as they are cast :)

PS. By the way, I'm stoked that you are still using scrolls @Chris Taylor :D
 
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Velrun

Velrun

Agree with Jason. Very wordy. At least cut vigilance.

You can maybe also cut reminder text for the existing Magic cards like Regrowth and Naturalize

Another option is to do like Wizards on You Line Up the Shot and only have the card create two different scrolls. And if you want a third option it could be to draw a card.

@Chris Taylor About our talk I can see what you’re saying. Maybe unknown custom cards are actually better than unknown official cards because you can make them so much cleaner. And they have a lot less card text, the scrolls that it.

Another option to incoorporate prowess into the cube is to run cards that give spells besides what they’re normally doing. Just like scrolls actually. Some examples are: Adventure, Learn and Flashback.



The Bonecrusher will give you an additional spell besides being a beater.

The professor will give you an additional spell besides being a beater.

The Bolt will give you an additional spell besides being a burn spell.
 
Velrun

Velrun

Hm yeah I agree with @Rusje

We had scrolls before Wizards on Arena had conjure. But after conjure became a thing, we might think about wording things differently.

Maybe scrolls should go to hand. Maybe they should go to command zone (with different color sleeves, smart). But either way the word conjure should maybe not be connected to scrolls anymore.

Maybe
Read a scroll?
Learn a scroll?
Create a scroll?
 
Brad

Brad

kryss said:
What kind of evasion would you give this guy to be good?
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Ward (X), where X is the number of other creatures you control.

Not sure how good that is, but it gives the card some internal tension and makes it an even bigger payoff on a huge board. And then I agree that Menace is a cool way to buff its attacks without making it a guaranteed kill.
 
LadyMapi

LadyMapi

Honestly, I feel like Scrolls could be handled more elegantly if you stole the wording from Legion Angel and did some jiggery-pokery with the Scrolls themselves:

Skyshroud Packleader - {1}{G}
Creature - Elf Scout
Reach
When ~ enters the battlefield, you may reveal a card you own outside of the game named Summon Golem and put it into your hand.
2/2

Summon Golem - {2}{G}
Sorcery - Scroll
(When a Scroll would be put anywhere other than its owner's hand or the stack, remove it from the game instead.)
Create a 3/3 colorless Golem artifact creature token.

EDIT: As a bonus:

Circle of Dreams Druid - {2}{G}
Creature - Human Druid
Vigilance
When Circle of Dreams Druid enters the battlefield, you may reveal a card you own outside the game named Hunt, Naturalize, or Regrowth and put it into your hand.
3/2
 
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