General Fight Club
- Thread starter Jason Waddell
- Start date
Chris Taylor
Contributor
Guys, all of these are to a player 
Pandemonium + Norin the Wary is fun. You really need a deck built to royally abuse Pandemonium because the effect is symetrical and your opponent probably gets to take advantage first.
I'd go with Outpost Siege if you want that sort of effect. It's kind of broken though, so don't put this in a lower power list.
I'd go with Outpost Siege if you want that sort of effect. It's kind of broken though, so don't put this in a lower power list.
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
You have a weird definition of broken...
Have you played this card before? It's good enough for a 450 power max list IMO.
Both modes are relevant and they work in the same sort of decks. And because it is a modular card, that just makes it that much more playable. If you have board presence or are ahead, then this card functions as both reach and a way to control the board in aggro-control shells. If you have no board, it's Phyrexian Arena without the life loss for 1 more mana. And in the Rakdos sacrifice deck, it's retarded.
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
Disenchant, Brainstorm, Bone Shredder, Siege-Gang Commander, and Acidic Slime (to name a few) are all good enough for a 360 power max cube. Does that mean the are even more broken than Outpost Siege? It is a very, very good card, but it is also one of the few reliable ways for red to get some much needed card advantage. The dragon side is a good way to close out games for an aggressive deck, by ensuring a casualty will still get you closer to a win. So, good, yes, but broken?
I don't know about broken, I usually classify those as must answer cards that either warp or outright take over the game. Outpost Siege has always been a pretty fair card imo. It's a 4 mana investment that won't pay off until the next turn at the earliest. If you're being pressured heavily by an aggro deck or someone's just going over the top of you by powering out bigger things, it doesn't really do enough. It's an excellent card in any grindy matchup or against control, that card advantage is just so amazing. I don't think I've ever actually used the other mode except the one time I was playing BR Aggro in Standard and I had 2 Hordeling Outburst in hand.
I'm on team "siege is good but not broken". I think the difficulty of dealing with the Enchantment for some decks makes it a little harder for my slower environment to deal with, so I decided to do with a more interactive version:
Who I think is one of the better designed PW's out there.
Who I think is one of the better designed PW's out there.
Alright, I concede the point.
I'm using broken pretty loosely here as I feel there are varying levels of brokenness. Not talking mox broken. But siege is good enough to where I think lists have to question whether including it will be a problem or not. It's a game warping card. Lower power lists with heavy sacrifice/recursion themes should not run that card IMO.
It is straight up busted in the all-in sacrifice deck. That card, plus a sack outlet and either tokens or recursive dudes is damn near unbeatable (though to be fair my cube is slower and lacks a lot of disenchant effects - so once this card is in play, you are on a clock). It's even possible to setup a board state where literally any action your opponent takes will ultimately kill them. I refer to it as the event horizon board state, where you think you are OK but you're actually just a deadman walking. Basically, just add blood artist or similar and season to taste. One game I just had the nut draw and I did something like 16 points of damage in one turn with a single combat and 5 mana. From nearly nothing in play (OK, Lingering Souls was involved... I know, I know). And what was truly awesome about it was the fact that next turn I would have lost the game. So it wasn't win more. It was steal-the-game-with-crazy-synergy. I was actually behind.
I'm using broken pretty loosely here as I feel there are varying levels of brokenness. Not talking mox broken. But siege is good enough to where I think lists have to question whether including it will be a problem or not. It's a game warping card. Lower power lists with heavy sacrifice/recursion themes should not run that card IMO.
It is straight up busted in the all-in sacrifice deck. That card, plus a sack outlet and either tokens or recursive dudes is damn near unbeatable (though to be fair my cube is slower and lacks a lot of disenchant effects - so once this card is in play, you are on a clock). It's even possible to setup a board state where literally any action your opponent takes will ultimately kill them. I refer to it as the event horizon board state, where you think you are OK but you're actually just a deadman walking. Basically, just add blood artist or similar and season to taste. One game I just had the nut draw and I did something like 16 points of damage in one turn with a single combat and 5 mana. From nearly nothing in play (OK, Lingering Souls was involved... I know, I know). And what was truly awesome about it was the fact that next turn I would have lost the game. So it wasn't win more. It was steal-the-game-with-crazy-synergy. I was actually behind.
Grillo_Parlante
Contributor
The fact that most cubes struggle to kill enchantments, and it just kind of sits there and wins the game, is why it would be considered broken.
Sure, its not treachery broken, but its not unreasonable to hate the card; losing to any kind of powerful enchantment is always a miserable experience.
Sure, its not treachery broken, but its not unreasonable to hate the card; losing to any kind of powerful enchantment is always a miserable experience.
Speculation. Scry 3 is really close to drawing a card, and the buyback cost is way more reasonable so you can run it in a prowess/tempo build.
I feel like Whispers of the Muse was good back in 2005 or so. But I think the game has gotten way too fast for a 5U draw engine to be playable. Most cubes can't even get Capsize to work anymore, and that thing is way more powerful. Mystic Speculation seems really interesting and I'm tempted to add it to see if the spells matter deck would benefit. This seems especially solid after a Niblis of Frost. You can even do 2UU and get two triggers for a potential alpha turn maybe.
I recently got rid of Omnath, Locus of Rage as the big RG creature in my cube. It's basically an eight-drop if you want to generate value, and it's still weak to mass removal which is commonly played at turn 8 (even if you ramp it out a few turns earlier). I found three potential replacements:
Which would you choose and why?
Which would you choose and why?
I recently got rid of Omnath, Locus of Rage as the big RG creature in my cube. It's basically an eight-drop if you want to generate value, and it's still weak to mass removal which is commonly played at turn 8 (even if you ramp it out a few turns earlier). I found three potential replacements:
Which would you choose and why?
If you want a fatty to ramp into, I love Maelstrom Wanderer. But I am an idiot who likes jamming as many colors and stupid cards into my cube decks as possible.
I recently got rid of Omnath, Locus of Rage as the big RG creature in my cube. It's basically an eight-drop if you want to generate value, and it's still weak to mass removal which is commonly played at turn 8 (even if you ramp it out a few turns earlier). I found three potential replacements:
Which would you choose and why?
I think it depends on what other RG cards you're running as well as whether you are supporting Natural Order, Reanimation, and ramp type strategies. I personally dislike Ruric Thar the most, it just seems like the most unfun out of the 3 to play with.
I think between Xenagos and Atarka I would choose Atarka but I'm not thrilled about either.. I dislike Xenagos because he does a really good job at gumming up the board.
That's what I dislike about Xenagos, too. The other two gruul cards are Huntmaster of the Fells and Bloodbraid Elf, I'm not sure if I want to remove Huntmaster as well, but otherwise I find it hard to find RG cards that drag people into those colours.
Gruul decks usually are RG Beatz or ramp/landfall decks, that's why I had Omnath, Locus of Rage in my cube. I guess I'll leave it as it is then, maybe a bit more landfall support in the form of Khalni Heart Expedition and the likes.
Gruul decks usually are RG Beatz or ramp/landfall decks, that's why I had Omnath, Locus of Rage in my cube. I guess I'll leave it as it is then, maybe a bit more landfall support in the form of Khalni Heart Expedition and the likes.
Hey, that's cool. Who knew that the card image tags would pick up foreign language cards as well? Did anyone else know about this, or am I just a:I recently got rid of Omnath, Locus of Rage as the big RG creature in my cube. It's basically an eight-drop if you want to generate value, and it's still weak to mass removal which is commonly played at turn 8 (even if you ramp it out a few turns earlier). I found three potential replacements:
Which would you choose and why?
Okay, I admit that that one didn't work, but I wanted comedic effect. It is fun to try and figure out what cards actually work though:
Are some of my favourite translations and all seem to work in the ci tags, even Chinese and Japanese.
This is really cool.
Are some of my favourite translations and all seem to work in the ci tags, even Chinese and Japanese.
This is really cool.
Chris Taylor
Contributor
My favorite blue 2 drop is
Grillo_Parlante
Contributor
Why can't I find you in real life
For RG Landfall/ramp beatz, Mina and Denn, Wildborn is amazing if you're not already running it (you should really link to your cubetutor if you have one in your signature!). Bloodbraid Elf is really cool too, and I pick her highly because she's a ton of fun to me
Right now my cube is passing through a bigger change because of balancing acts. It won't last long until I post it again (although 'again' only refers to former posts on other forums as I never actually posted it here, I think). Apropos balancing act..
vs
vs
The two on the left are the ones I evaluate a bit weaker as their left counterparts. Do you think so, too? Or are they different role-players which could be fit into a cube simultaneously? And what about Ongoing Investigation? It seems to be not as strong as Edric, Spymaster of Trest which I actually find to be too strong and too boring, and not as weak as Retreat to Kazandu.
vs vs The two on the left are the ones I evaluate a bit weaker as their left counterparts. Do you think so, too? Or are they different role-players which could be fit into a cube simultaneously? And what about Ongoing Investigation? It seems to be not as strong as Edric, Spymaster of Trest which I actually find to be too strong and too boring, and not as weak as Retreat to Kazandu.
I recently got rid of Omnath, Locus of Rage as the big RG creature in my cube. It's basically an eight-drop if you want to generate value, and it's still weak to mass removal which is commonly played at turn 8 (even if you ramp it out a few turns earlier). I found three potential replacements:
Which would you choose and why?
I'm going to give this one a shot in my cube: