Sets [KLD] Kaladesh Spoilers Thread

[Aston]

Vehicles seem like equipment that are much easier to interact with to me.

 

[Alfonzo Bonzo]

Cannot wait to get in my smuggler copter.

 

[Onderzeeboot]

Vehicles seem like equipment that are much easier to interact with to me.

That's... an interesting take on vehicles and it doesn't sound wrong.

 

[ahadabans]

Vehicles seem like equipment that are much easier to interact with to me.

Sort of like how Planeswalkers are easier to interact with enchantments?

I mean, that isn't a wrong way to look at it. But just because they might be easier to interact with doesn't take away from the focus both of these things (vehicles and walkers) place on creatures.

 

[FlowerSunRain]

The more focus there is on creatures, the better. Creature combat is the "boardplay" of magic. If a game is going to have a major mechanic, participating in it shouldn't be optional, particularly since in Magic cards have specific purposes and you have to pick them before the game begins. Its really lame when a large percentage of your deck doesn't function/isn't relevant to your opponent (and vice versa) because they aren't playing the same game as you.

 

[Eric Chan]

Yeah, the mothership article last week that explained how vehicles are basically "fixed" equipment sold this new direction for me. Basically, you don't have to pack artifact removal specifically to deal with troublesome vehicles; they're still useless without bodies to jump aboard them; they have more knobs on them to cost them more fairly, in general, than equipment, which tends to be either bonkers or completely useless; and they give the pilot more play than with equipment, as you have to make a choice every turn whether or not to crew your vehicles.

As someone who's slowly whittled down my equipment suite from a half dozen early on to just two Bonesplitters now, I'm really looking forward to revving up these new engines.

 

[Onderzeeboot]

http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/top-decks/what-stays-and-what-goes-2016-09-16

I lol'd at the list of important cards leaving standard

Also, full spoiler up!

http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/card-image-gallery/kaladesh

 

[Onderzeeboot]

A lot of cute cards were still unspoiled!

 

[whydirt]

I hope Kaladesh plays as well as it looks! It's the first set that makes me want to build a draft sim around.

 

[Onderzeeboot]

Black has an insane number of fun, playable two-drops. That's one of the slots we've traditionally struggled to fill, and this set has multiple good options! Insane!

Also, the flavor text on Harsh Scrutiny is awesome.

 

[FlowerSunRain]

Veteran Motorist is quite a card.

Now that every single 2 cost beater has 3 power, there is a minor conundrum in that blockers need to have 4 toughness which is turn means 3 damage no longer is good enough for "clear the way" removal. I've already been attempting to deal with this by using auras and other non-permanent blocker removal (falters/evasion granters/threatens), but maybe its time to embrace this more fully and really start to cut efficient burn that hits players (which is one of the least interesting ways to win a game).

 

[sigh]

I really like this card. Its probably too inconsistent to be good, and the wheel effect isn't a 'may', but it's still awesome. Solid 'combo' potential with stuff like life from the loam and Delve. Not quite sure how to evaluate it power level wise, tbh.

This card seems awesome! Cheap enchantment that can sink mana for the good of the team? Nice! Don't know if I have a slot for this, but it's really attractive for supporting what GW likes doing.

I just noticed that this is an instant! Wow, that's pretty good, even without the Energy text. there's definitely some cards in this set that make me ponder whether or not to include cards even though they effectively have trinket text. Veteran Motorist if definitely on that list.

 

[Onderzeeboot]

I'm now wondering if there is merit in replacing equipment with vehicles...

 

[whydirt]

You can't make "vroom, vroom" noises with equipment, so it's a pretty easy upgrade in my opinion.

 

[Chris Taylor]

This is a weirdly good body for an artifact creature

Boy, we got G1 3/2 and 2/3 in the same set! (Also this is better than just a 2/3, but it can be if you want which is nice)

Upgraded Rabid Bite?

Another suprisingly nice artifact creature

 

[whydirt]

I like Eager Construct a lot since symmetric scrying should generally lead to fewer non-games.

 

[Chris Taylor]

Expect a Necro Shortly:
http://riptidelab.com/forum/threads/how-to-execute-a-minimalist-artifact-theme.681/
http://riptidelab.com/forum/threads/artifact-creatures.1446/
http://riptidelab.com/forum/threads/artifact-and-enchantment-themed-cube.1068/
For those of us looking to add an artifact theme with kaladesh

 

[psly4mne]

I like Eager Construct a lot since symmetric scrying should generally lead to fewer non-games.

The symmetric scrying will only lead to fewer non-games if someone puts a vanilla bear in their deck. Is that something you expect to happen?

 

[Peter LaCara]

Jeez. Even if I ignore all the energy cards and all the vehicles, this set still feels like it has more stuff for me than usual.



EDIT -

Ugh. Card images aren't up yet. Here:

Spoiler

Angel of Invention
Fairgrounds Warden
Fumigate
Glint-Nest Crane
Insidious Will
Torrential Gearhulk
Embraal Bruiser
Chandra, Torch of Defiance
Combustible Gearhulk
Inventor’s Apprentice
Armorcraft Judge
Blossoming Defense
Cultivator of Blades
Nature’s Way
Nissa, Vital Force
Cloudblazer
Dovin Baan
Rashmi, Eternities Crafter
Saheeli Rai
Filigree Familiar
Scrapheap Scrounger
Inventors’ Fair

 

[Rasmus Källqvist]

The symmetric scrying will only lead to fewer non-games if someone puts a vanilla bear in their deck. Is that something you expect to happen?

It's not a vanilla bear, it has scry on it.

 

[psly4mne]

It's not a vanilla bear, it has scry on it.

Symmetric scry, so I don't think you would run it in any deck where you wouldn't run a vanilla bear.

 

[Golvin]

I'm a little nervous about vehicles honestly. Has anyone gotten in testing yet?

Here's my concern. The game has already really pushed creatures. Been doing that for years. And vehicles are just an extension of that. They really encourage you to just run as many bodies as you can. Vehicles (not being actual dudes) dodge wraths and they turn any late game 1 drop (that would normally be a near blank) into a serious hasty evasive threat.

Are creature based strategies really having problems in the modern game to where this type of thing is needed? I'm ranting a bit but that was an honest question here. Speaking from my cube experience only, I don't think aggressive decks need more help dominating slower strategies. Like at all.

I may be overly optimistic, but what I think will happen in my cube (a mid-range speed environment) is that aggro will gain a notable benefit while control and mid-range will not be highly effected by the vehicle mechanic. (There is some value in the ramping ability of Cultivator Caravan to five color and ramp decks). Aggro benefits from the haste and stat boost that vehicles provide to smaller creatures that are quickly trumped by mid-range and control's threats and/or walls. Both points become exacerbated after a board wipe hits. But, I view that as a positive thing environments that lean towards mid-range and control provided you are looking to strengthen aggro (as I am slightly).

This is not to say that vehicles will adversely affect control. Most likely they will have a threat that can either trump the vehicle in question, instant speed removal, or the aggro deck may have overextended itself. Control can benefit from the mechanic early on by allowing their Merfolk Looters crew a vehicle defensively, but will not be able to use do so with the better offensive ones (e.g. Skysovereign, Consul Flagship). There are also better threats that take less work like the Titans, Massacre Wurm, etc.

Mid-range decks, depending on their speed, can fall under either the aggro or control arguments. Testing is need to be able to determine how vehicle will affect mid-range in a cube fully.

 

[FlowerSunRain]

It won't happen in my cube, but I'm quite happy that somewhere Jace the Mindsculptor will be getting run over by a train.

 

[Chris Taylor]

This could also be decent. 2nd toughness and vigilance for a downside? (Given the baseline of Daring Skyjek for eg)
Edit: Ah Crap:

 

[ahadabans]

The more focus there is on creatures, the better. Creature combat is the "boardplay" of magic. If a game is going to have a major mechanic, participating in it shouldn't be optional, particularly since in Magic cards have specific purposes and you have to pick them before the game begins. Its really lame when a large percentage of your deck doesn't function/isn't relevant to your opponent (and vice versa) because they aren't playing the same game as you.

Well, I respectfully disagree with all that.

I get the feeling people think that anything which isn't a creature is somehow "uninteractive". Don't confuse all spell based strategies with storm. You can cast a spell that doesn't put a creature on the board and still be interacting.

Creature strategies are fine but if that is all we are doing, we've devolved the game into something far less than it started. On a related note, I'd love to see a set that focused on more spell based win conditions. It's just becoming a lot harder to make a strategy that isn't reliant on dudes. And that's a shame because those decks are just as much fun to play. And having that represented makes things feel a lot less linear.