Where does Dusk // Dawn do its best / where are you seeing it played? In regular white weenies decks?
Card/Deck Single Card Spotlight
- Thread starter Dom Harvey
- Start date
I think tiny aggro is the best home for it, but I've seen it run in creature-light control decks as well, particularly those running Thing in the Ice and pals. Given that my only true sweeper in the format is Nevinyrral's Disk, it gets lots of attention, but I'd imagine the stock goes down if you're running Wrath of God et al.
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
I run a format where all hard wrath effects are 5 mana or more (so Fumigate yes, Wrath of God no), and there Dusk // Dawn is certainly good enough. I'm currently playtesting Rivals of Ixalan adds, and in one of the test games the AI blew up my Elephant token (Assault // Battery), Frilled Deathspitter and another 3 power troop, then he got back Duplicant and Thalia, Guardian of Thraben. It's slow, but pretty cool!
I don't really like conspiracies, but this one is tempting.
I'd run it in my "rare" module, which means it has a lower chance of showing up.
Does anyone have experiences with it?
Also, now that I have a wider power band (the late picks are much worse or much more narrow than the early picks), this might be more balanced, but I'm still scared of it:
I'd run it in my "rare" module, which means it has a lower chance of showing up.
Does anyone have experiences with it?
Also, now that I have a wider power band (the late picks are much worse or much more narrow than the early picks), this might be more balanced, but I'm still scared of it:
Unexpected Potential was pretty GRBS when I ran it. Hated what it did to the format and it made decks pretty goodstuffy, especially when I still did more singleton breaks. It's one of those cards that you put in as a designer thinking "oh, what sort of techy play will this enable?!" but really it just means a deck gets a top-end bomb or removal spell that it shouldn't so easily have. Really dislike what 99% of conspiracies do to a format.
Given that I want removal to be available to all decks and try to keep all my bombs at a power level below the answers, it might work in my environment then.
Yeah, I don't really like any of the other conspiracies. Wish they were more balanced or had a cost involved.
It's not as simple as "I want my bombs to be equal and my removal to be accessible", it's moreso that giving a player access to a color pie violation (ie, running a strong white spell in a blue/green deck) undercuts archetypal design and makes the format feel more generic. If you aren't pursuing a decks-not-cards format, then you will probably find it enjoyable
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
Ok, while testing my cube changes for Rivals of Ixalan, this happened. I think this is a pretty damn perfect home for Dusk // Dawn, and it's not a white weenie deck!
Abzan Dawn
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Customs:
I run a similar format where all my board wipes are 5 cost or more (except Supreme Verdict, which is 4 cost as a reward for going into that guild...no idea if that is a good idea) in an effort to boost aggro. Maybe Dusk//Dawn would go well in my cube.
Anyone run this? I'm looking for another card that cross pollinates Stoneforge Mystic with "Aristocrats" that isn't named Skullclamp. Already have Grafted Wargear.
I'm currently playing a copy, and can say with utmost certainty that it is too weak for your format. Generally, you drop it turn 2 as a roadblock in your sacrifice deck. They swing with their 2/2 or whatever, you throw it in front of their attacker and take a point off their life total. Then it can serve as an unimpressive mana sink late game, to pressure their life total or occasionally tweak combat in your favor. Essentially, the card needs a format where x/1s for two mana are common enough for the floor to be acceptable. Any list with Stoneforge Mystic is probably a no-go.
Utmost certainty, eh? I have it in my high powered list and it is awesome. It's not a universal good stuff powerhouse, but it fits well as a synergy piece in a lot of different decks. My list is particularly wanting of the synergy it provides however, so you'd have to try for yourself to see how well it fits yours. Our x/1 percentages aren't too much different either. (16.7% for me vs 14.1% for you)
At the risk of being pedantic, Stoneforge Mystic's power is proportional to the equipment you run, so not necessarily.
Well, any synergistic card's power level can fluctuate wildly depending on context. I notice your list runs a myriad of token producers to create sacrifice fodder, while I run very few effects that create 3+ bodies. In addition, I find that in my format mana is often very tied-up late game by all the Flashback, Aftermath and Deserts. All I know, is that I am on the verge of cutting Mortarpod for being too weak, and my format is much lower-powered than Inscho's. YMMV.
Is that totally true though? The tutor effect is still card advantage, and a 1/2 is more impactful in an environment with weaker creatures. You could purposefully run very few Equipment in your cube, but assuming the card is well supported, Mystic does have some amount of raw strength. Besides, by that logic you could argue that any tutor or card draw is worse in a low power format than a more powerful one, because the cards you are getting are weaker.
There are a few factors that I could see changing the value of Stoneforge Mystic:
- Density of 1/1s, which Mystic can block favorably
- Number of high-cmc Equipment to take advantage of its second ability
- A wide power band; when certain cards are much stronger than others the value of tutors goes up
- Quality and density of targets
Dom Harvey
Contributor
Has anyone made these work?
I'm also curious if anyone has found uses for:
in a high-power format. I've seen lots of slower formats built around these but it always seems like something is lost in translation when the power level goes up.
I'm also curious if anyone has found uses for:
in a high-power format. I've seen lots of slower formats built around these but it always seems like something is lost in translation when the power level goes up.
I'd say that my format is a step up from Grillo's in power level (he is free to dispute me, I don't say it to brag), and I find Chromatic Star very desirable over here. I think it's moreso about the card advantage tools you put into your environment, really. If you make sure blue isn't the "card draw color" and cull 1-mana draw effects, it's great.
What does Chromatic Star do? Are people picking it for artifact synergy? For fixing? Prowess?
I was considering building a little eggs theme into my cube to replace some fixing lands. But I am not sure what it does to a format.
I was considering building a little eggs theme into my cube to replace some fixing lands. But I am not sure what it does to a format.
Yes.
And the list goes on. Reduces deck size, storm count, trinket mage. All around useful little trinket
Grillo_Parlante
Contributor
The best and most subtle thing about the eggs, is that they introduce colorless smoothing into a format. If you think you can get away with running them, I think they are worth a trial run.
What about running a bunch (maube 10?) Wayfarer 's Bauble instead of fixing lands or something like that? I feel like it could be a more rich resource than lands as they are more flexible pieces, benefit from artifact recursion, and tie into landfall.
I've been running shock + fetch but I am looking for more mechanically dense fixing and also fewer dead cards in each draft.
I've been running shock + fetch but I am looking for more mechanically dense fixing and also fewer dead cards in each draft.
Grillo_Parlante
Contributor
If been toying around with the idea of a Mirrodon-esque draft environment for a while now, where all of the smoothing comes from cheap artifacts.
There is a huge body of 1-3cc cantriping artifacts, that either fix in some way, or provide interesting incidental utility.
There is a huge body of 1-3cc cantriping artifacts, that either fix in some way, or provide interesting incidental utility.