Card/Deck Single Card Spotlight

[Eric Chan]

Even if the average converted mana cost of your black aggressive deck is, say, 2.4 - which is a conservative estimate - you have to remember that Dark Confidant will flip up lands a lot of the time. Assuming 23 spells and 17 lands, the average damage you'll take per turn is (23 * 2.4) / 40 = 1.38 damage - i.e. a hair over 4 damage over the next three turns - which is well within reason for the snowballing card advantage he provides. He's a one-toughness dude, too, so whenever you feel like his job is complete, you can start sending him into the red zone to meet his maker.

 

[Onderzeeboot]

Ok, you convinced me guys. There's probably a good reason it's so expensive as well

 

[spicewitch]

Whenever something is expensive, blame constructed.

 

[CML]

honestly the major reason bob is so nuts in legacy is nobody ever kills him. now that cruise bolt plow decks are gone bob and lilly will reign again. in modern the curves are a little higher but everyone has removal and he is no good. in cube you have to draft around him and the environment is closer to modern in both curve and prevalence of removal. bob is obviously a card that should be in each of our lists and its power level is, i think, directly tied to the quality of the environment, both power-wise and design-wise, he is in.

 

[Onderzeeboot]

honestly the major reason bob is so nuts in legacy is nobody ever kills him. now that cruise bolt plow decks are gone bob and lilly will reign again. in modern the curves are a little higher but everyone has removal and he is no good. in cube you have to draft around him and the environment is closer to modern in both curve and prevalence of removal. bob is obviously a card that should be in each of our lists and its power level is, i think, directly tied to the quality of the environment, both power-wise and design-wise, he is in.

This is a sweet post.

 

[spicewitch]

It might be sweet, but it's gibberish!

 

[Onderzeeboot]

It might be sweet, but it's gibberish!

Nah, it might sound like he's contradicting himself (because he is), but that doesn't make the closing thought less profound, which, in my own words, is this (I think...): Bob scales to the power level of your cube. He is very powerful in the cubes he needs to be very powerful in, and he is merely good where he needs to be merely good. Bob will never be overpowered in your cube, precisely because his power is directly tied to the power of your cube. He will, therefore, always play at the power level you need him to play at. So, celebrate this triumph of design and include it in your cube. Always. (If you own a copy that is.)

 

[spicewitch]

Okay. Then "bob" is dark confidant, "lilly" is one or more versions of Lilliana, and "cruise bolt plow" is some kind of Delve or Unearth combo maybe?

 

[shamizy]

Okay. Then "bob" is dark confidant, "lilly" is one or more versions of Lilliana, and "cruise bolt plow" is some kind of Delve or Unearth combo maybe?

 

[Grillo_Parlante]

Bob=dark confidant. Confidant was an invitational card, and its designer was Bob maher.

Lilly is Innistrad liliana.

Cruise-bolt-plow refers to the U/R treasure cruise fueled delver decks and the URW stoneforge decks. The U/R delver decks were basically burn decks, which makes a card like confidant bad for both the life loss and its vulnerability as a draw engine. The stoneforge decks could run bolt, plow, and treasure cruise.

Cruise made any sort of attrition strategy virtually obsolete, as the strategy fueled the very treasure cruises whose card advantage negated the effects of discard. Hence Liliana decks (which often run confidant as a draw engine) were largely obsolete while cruise was legal (in both legacy and modern).

 

[CML]

deranged hermeneutics! grillo's got it all right.

bob is a terrible card in the modo cube but fits most cubes here which desirably push the curve down far below retail limited.

 

[Onderzeeboot]

Okay. Then "bob" is dark confidant, "lilly" is one or more versions of Lilliana, and "cruise bolt plow" is some kind of Delve or Unearth combo maybe?

Bob = Bob Maher, the player who won an invitational and got to design Dark Confidant.
Lilly = Liliana of the Veil (and no other )

Also, the part where CML seemingly contradicts himself is when he says Bob is nuts in Legacy, but unplayable in Modern, then states our cubes are closer to Modern in power level and Bob is an auto-include. But if our cubes are closer to Modern in power level, and Bob is unplayable in Modern, doesn't that mean Bob is unplayable in our cubes?

And then the sweet part of the post hits home

Edit: Wow... I shouldn't brush my teeth while replying. Much slow!

 

[Lucre]

honestly the major reason bob is so nuts in legacy is nobody ever kills him. now that cruise bolt plow decks are gone bob and lilly will reign again. in modern the curves are a little higher but everyone has removal and he is no good. in cube you have to draft around him and the environment is closer to modern in both curve and prevalence of removal. bob is obviously a card that should be in each of our lists and its power level is, i think, directly tied to the quality of the environment, both power-wise and design-wise, he is in.

For a little while I was asking Eric if he had thought about doubling Xathrids and Bobs to see if they could extend the white human theme into black and give more dork decks a new route to extra cards. Bob's an interesting card that is far from broken and it'd be neat to see more cube decks built around it.

But people here are really into their expensive removal and dudes so mileage may vary right? Plus it might make some decks too consistent, but its super easy to outpace / remove bob.

 

[James Stevenson]

deranged hermeneutics!

Excellent!

 

[DreamPaint]

Anyone have experience playing with alpha version Orcish Oriflamme?

 

[GenericZero]

I know this is out of left field, but has anyone heard from CML? Cuz I just wanted to share my endless glee over the Patriot's latest Superbowl victory.

 

[Diakonov]

Anyone have experience playing with alpha version Orcish Oriflamme?

I run it, it's great.

 

[CML]

due to the sheer volume of bile i have sent out over the last several hours i will not be able to produce it here. just check out my fb page. but here is a statistical rundown:

racial/ethnic slurs used (not at anyone, just describing pats personnel) -- 4
abortion jibes (baby dressed in pats gear) -- 1
ridicule of "trigger warning" -- 1
public incitement to riot (burning Amazon) -- 1
other instances of "hate speech" -- a lot
jokes about the boston marathon -- not enough
titles won by Gronk -- 2 (my FF team, and the other one)

 

[Onderzeeboot]

I know this is out of left field, but has anyone heard from CML? Cuz I just wanted to share my endless glee over the Patriot's latest Superbowl victory.

This took a while for me to understand. Man, I don't know anything about American Football...

 

[spicewitch]

How do folks feel about this? Too narrow - healing subtheme? Or too wide - a hoser against any and all aggro? That said, aggro often includes , which eats artifacts all up. So mebbe it's fine.

Basically, I want to include it but worry there are consequences.

 

[Onderzeeboot]

The best consequence is Ajani's Pridemate.

 

[shamizy]

Too damn slow. And I play EDH also. And was even slow there the one time I tried it.

 

[Chris Taylor]

Nice side not on Bob:


Wammies!

 

[Diakonov]

How do folks feel about this? Too narrow - healing subtheme? Or too wide - a hoser against any and all aggro? That said, aggro often includes , which eats artifacts all up. So mebbe it's fine.

Basically, I want to include it but worry there are consequences.

I'd try Pristine Talisman if you wanted that sort of effect. Half as many upkeeps, but triggers life gain repeatedly.

 

[CML]

Talisman is OK but usually doesn't ramp you up to much of anything. Mainly I'm excited for Chan to lower his Cube's power level so he can play a bunch of cards like this.

Two of my good friends have built type-4 stacks and man some of the cards you can play there look like a delight.