General Custom Cards: The Lab

psly4mne

psly4mne

I like the idea of promoting a creature to commander instead of starting with one. Definitely going to tinker with that.

I had the cost as +{2} each time (and not exiling a card) originally. I added the exile because otherwise you're always starting a card up on your opponent, and gaining another card with each recast. That's fine if everyone gets a commander, but even +1 guaranteed card advantage is nuts. I also changed the mana increase from {2} to {1} because my format is fast enough that paying an extra {2} is generally poor and paying an extra {4} is almost never going to happen.
 
safra

safra

The commander mechanic is almost impossible to balance to begin with imo. It's a repeatable tutor and regrowth effect for your best card at zero deck space taken up...
 
psly4mne

psly4mne

That's why I like Onder's suggestion. That eliminates the tutor aspect, and it probably doesn't get your best card. Given that it's not a guarantee that the card will go to your command zone at all, I'm inclined to give you the first recast at normal cost.

Take Command.png
The "from your hand" is because I need to make sure you own your commander. I could also say "whenever you cast a creature spell you own", but that sounds weirder.
 
Onderzeeboot

Onderzeeboot

Ecstatic Orb
I think this is a lot better than the original, but do keep in mind that it's still a free Raise Dead that doesn't take up a deck slot, which is a very strong effect. I'ld playtest it like this, and if it's too strong increase the casting cost by {2} from the get-go.
 
Kirblinx

Kirblinx

Developer
Staff member
psly4mne said:
View attachment 945
I need help with this. I'm pretty sure this is way too good, just because you can do stuff like guaranteeing turn 2 Bob every game as I did in my last draft, or guaranteeing a turn 2 4/4 Epochrasite as I did in the draft before (though Take Command was a little different then). Is there some way to keep the concept (play commander!) while being kind of balanced? Maybe a CMC restriction, though that feels a little clunky.
Click to expand...

I thought it had a restriction of making your deck size larger at one point. What was wrong with that restriction? Making you play with a bigger deck to lose consistency, while gaining the consistency of having a creature you will always see seemed like an interesting dynamic. Although still pretty busted. I think if the conspiracy was changed to 'you start with the named card in your hand and your minimum deck size is increased by 10' I would still probably play the conspiracy without the rest of the commander text.

The newer version is better as giving a random card is better than always having access to your best creature. But as Safra pointed out being able to have a free raise dead for your best creature is just insane. I don't want to deal with Grave Titan once, let alone again if I actually manage to survive for two turns. Also, why can't you just force them to name the card at the start like other conspiracies? Being able to change to a decent enough creature if you can't find your best card seems unnecessary and probably just as broken as the first version. Surely having unlimited raise deads for a creature means your opponent can hope you don't draw it, because otherwise they will never see the end of it otherwise.

My suggestion to make it 'possibly fair and balanced':

Hidden Agenda (Start the game with this conspiracy face down in the command zone and secretly name a card. You may turn this conspiracy face up any time and reveal the chosen name.)
Your minimum deck size is increased by 10.
Whenever a creature with the chosen name leaves play you my put it in the command zone instead and put a tax counter on this.
You may cast creatures from your command zone.
Creatures you cast from your command zone cost {2} more to cast for each tax counter on this.

Don't mind the counter thing, that just made it easier for my to grok. This still probably isn't completely fixed but I feel it is getting to the power level of Double Stroke and Worldknit. You could do a vanguard-eque thing and make people lower their starting life or cards in hand to possibly make it fair.
Also the wording on mine makes anything other than singleton go bonkers (Squadron Hawk anyone? :p) but that is what I get for using the Hidden Agenda keyword.
 
psly4mne

psly4mne

We removed the deck size increase when we added the exile cost. Maybe it's still needed, but the amount of text on the card is pushing it. I would definitely not increase deck size in the hidden agenda version, because that's making it less likely that you find your commander.

The hidden agenda version of the card is really conditional: you have to draw the creature and have it be removed, and still have time to recast it. Your opponent is also less likely to point removal at a creature they suspect is your commander (with that version, they can't be sure). Still, the payoff is pretty good. I'll run both versions by the group.

I might also try something like
Hidden Agenda
~ starts the game with a command counter on it.
Remove a command counter from ~: Return target creature card with the chosen name from your graveyard or exile to your hand.
That's a little less blantantly "this is commander", but it kind of captures the essence of it in a simple way.

Or:
Hidden Agenda
{X}{X} (maybe {2}{X}{X}): Return target creature card with the chosen name from your graveyard or exile to your hand, then put a tax counter on ~. X is the number of tax counters on ~.
About equivalent to Kirblinx's version, but simpler.

Or, for the non-HA version:
Whenever you cast a creature spell from your hand, if you have not noted a name in this way, you may note its name.
{X}{X} (maybe {2}{X}{X}): Return target creature card with the noted name from your graveyard or exile to your hand, then put a tax counter on ~. X is the number of tax counters on ~.
Your minimum deck size is increased by five.

I might end up adjusting the costs from {X}{X} to "{X}, exile a card from your hand" again, but that's easier to do when it's less explicitly tied to the commander rules.
 
Suicufnoc

Suicufnoc

anotak said:
anything with a graveyard is cool in my book

my only concern is how can it be a super body double if it no longer combos with reveillark
Click to expand...

Good point, I'll make it a 2/17 ;) P/T is kinda unnecessary when it can copy anything anyways.

Weird thing with some nutty synergies:
Loam Master.jpg
(and too powerful. WCS is a 1/3 mana dork.)
 
Chris Taylor

Chris Taylor

Contributor
I mean the copy isn't mandatory. Sometimes you want a 2/17 :p

Also holy shit that loam card. Fuck Earthcraft, unless you get Geddon'd the turn she comes down that's insane ramp :p

Scion needs changeling IMO, and I do like the change to body double, even though I think it should still be a 0/0. Always kinda weirded me out that blue just has zombify, but not really.
 
safra

safra

I like that Scion is a nod to the old Full English Breakfast combo, so why is the image Life cereal? That was an Illusions/Necro/Donate deck.

Loam Master is seriously busted.

Necrotic Worm is very, very exciting, potentially too strong with Scion in the same format.
 
Onderzeeboot

Onderzeeboot

Ecstatic Orb
Suicufnoc said:
Yeah feel free to come up with names or art, I was lazy. Is there a way to do a fair version of the loam guy?
Click to expand...
Well, going by Chrome Mox, the text should probably be:

Creatures you control have: "{T}: Add one mana of any of this card's colors to your mana pool."

As for the casting cost and stats, effects like this have been printed a few times already. Citanul Hierophants excites no one, so it's got to be better than that. Cryptolith Rite is the right power level for constructed, but not exciting for limited, but (and this is a big but) doesn't tap for mana itself! Seton, Krosan Protector sucks. You're alluding to a creature based ramp strategy with this card, so I wonder if you want an aggressive body or a defensive body actually. Maybe 3/2 for {2}{G} is fair? Or even 2/1 for {1}{G}? 2/1 is a lot easier to deal with han 1/3 most of the time (which is a good thing with such a strong effect), though I expect the effect is a lot stronger on a 2 drop than it is on a 3 drop.
 
psly4mne

psly4mne

Loam Master does not let your lands tap for {c}, since that is not a color.

This card has been in my cube for years:
Lifebound Druid.png
It probably functions pretty similarly. It's really strong in the right deck, and I think the group has undervalued it overall. I'm probably going to drop the loot trigger, because looting is off-color and it's good enough without it in the right deck.
 
Suicufnoc

Suicufnoc

That makes more sense for the normal part of the effect, but I want to be to use Life from the Loam as a triple regrowth, use frantic search to untap creatures, stuff like that.

(Break Titania in half, Knight of the Reliquary and Prime Time cheat creatures into play, Sylvan Advocate is pumped and pumps all creatures,)

Oh dang can you play a land for free even if it has a mana cost? Card is wayyy to broken. Will think of a fix.
 
Suicufnoc

Suicufnoc

How is this power-wise? It doesn't probablt need flash for power, but the top of library thing doesn't make much sense without flash, and it's not worth discarding a land(sometimes) unless it TOL instead of hand.
Spirit Guide.jpg
 
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