Sets [ELD] Throne of Eldraine

Onderzeeboot

Onderzeeboot

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Velrun said:
You mean like an almost always better Manic Vandal right?

You can cast it for 2 instead of 3.
You can also pay the full 3 mana like Vandal and then they have the same ETB effect.
You can also cast it for 1 for a removal. And then much later get a small blocker/attacker

Only upside to Vandal is the 1 extra toughness. This is a deal but not a big deal. And it doesn’t outweigh the tempo you can choose at 2 mana.
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2 toughness vs 1 toughness is relevant, but it's also the difference between {1}{R}{R} and {2}{R}. Of course casting it over turns is a real thing, but still. I think I'ld rather play Hearth Kami.
 
Onderzeeboot

Onderzeeboot

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Interesting. I've got a historic theme in white, and already a fair share of knights that I'm willing to expand on. Probably not better than Tome of Legends though.
 
Velrun

Velrun

Onderzeeboot said:
2 toughness vs 1 toughness is relevant, but it's also the difference between {1}{R}{R} and {2}{R}. Of course casting it over turns is a real thing, but still. I think I'ld rather play Hearth Kami.
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Leave Hearth Kami out of it. We’re talking about Vandal. Are you seriously experiencing Embereth Shieldbreaker as a weaker Vandal? It is almost better in every single way. Faster and cheaper, more flexible and with the option of being the exactly same card. The downside is not really a downside because you can choose to cast it over two turns if you want to.
 
Onderzeeboot

Onderzeeboot

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Velrun said:
Leave Hearth Kami out of it. We’re talking about Vandal. Are you seriously experiencing Embereth Shieldbreaker as a weaker Vandal? It is almost better in every single way. Faster and cheaper, more flexible and with the option of being the exactly same card. The downside is not really a downside because you can choose to cast it over two turns if you want to.
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Can't be blinked or reanimated for the artifact destruction part either. For some reason I'm experiencing/parsing it as a choice between 2/2 for {2}{R} and a 2/1 for {1}{R}{R}, in which case the Vandal flat out wins. I guess the Embereth Shieldbreaker can be cashed in for a Goblin Piker, but that isn't all too exciting, is it?
 
Velrun

Velrun

Onderzeeboot said:
Can't be blinked or reanimated for the artifact destruction part either. For some reason I'm experiencing/parsing it as a choice between 2/2 for {2}{R} and a 2/1 for {1}{R}{R}, in which case the Vandal flat out wins. I guess the Embereth Shieldbreaker can be cashed in for a Goblin Piker, but that isn't all too exciting, is it?
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You clearly misunderstood the whole notion of kicker spells.

They are usually a lot worse at any given time than their equal mana counterpart BUT the extra flexibility wins them the fight anyways.

And in this case there is historically little difference between them at 3 mana. Yet the new Shieldbreaker can also be cast at 1 mana or at 2 mana or at 3 mana. Vandal will have to take a bench here until turn 3 and pray Enemy has an artifact.
 
Onderzeeboot

Onderzeeboot

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Velrun said:
You clearly misunderstood the whole notion of kicker spells.
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I don't think I do. This mechanic is fantastically flexible. I'm just saying there is a big difference between {1}{R}{R} and {2}{R}, as well as a big difference between 2/1 and 2/2, and I don't know if the flexibility of having a Goblin Piker over a Gray Ogre if there are no artifacts around to destroy is worth it, as those are of comparable power level. If there is an artifact, the Vandal might well be better, though destroying it for {R} is admittedly nice. Anyway, all of this is no knock on the adventure mechanic as a whole, which I really like.

In other news, here's another 3 cmc mana artifact that's quite cute! Best in mana hungry token decks, I presume.

heraldicbanner.jpg
 
Velrun

Velrun

This is just hilarious. I am in disbelief but I also don’t want to bore the rest of the forum anymore with my inquisition.
 
TrainmasterGT

TrainmasterGT

Onderzeeboot said:
Can't be blinked or reanimated for the artifact destruction part either. For some reason I'm experiencing/parsing it as a choice between 2/2 for {2}{R} and a 2/1 for {1}{R}{R}, in which case the Vandal flat out wins. I guess the Embereth Shieldbreaker can be cashed in for a Goblin Piker, but that isn't all too exciting, is it?
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Velrun said:
You clearly misunderstood the whole notion of kicker spells.

They are usually a lot worse at any given time than their equal mana counterpart BUT the extra flexibility wins them the fight anyways.

And in this case there is historically little difference between them at 3 mana. Yet the new Shieldbreaker can also be cast at 1 mana or at 2 mana or at 3 mana. Vandal will have to take a bench here until turn 3 and pray Enemy has an artifact.
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All right, lets settle this by looking at the positives and negatives of both-
Manic Vandal
Positives-
-Can Be Blinked.
-Has 2 toughness.

Negatives-
-Floor is a Gray Ogre.
-Always costs {2}{R}.

Embereth Shieldbreaker
Positives-
-Has 3 different modes: Smelt and Goblin Piker across two turns, Smelt and Goblin Piker in one turn, just a Goblin Piker.
-Casting the Smelt and Goblin Piker can occur at different times- this can be used to snipe moxes on turn one and still act as a creature later.
-Can function as an on-curve aggro creature.
-Can be used to trigger prowess and Young Pyromancers.

Negatives-
-Has 1 Toughness.
-Can't be reused unless cast from hand again.

The only time Embereth Shieldbreaker is worse pound for pound than Manic Vandal is when it's being cast all at once. The ability to work in spells decks and be cast on turn two is quite good to me.

I see Hearth Kami was mentioned, which I think is weird since Shieldbreaker is way better than that. I would like to take a line from Usman's GRN cube review to illustrate this point.
Usman Jamil said:
When Evan Erwin was on the Magic Cruise in 2009, he described cards like Hearth Kami as being powerful in Cube. Being new to the format, I took this as gospel but I've found over the years that these kinds of cards aren't powerful as much as useful to deal with annoying artifacts. As an answer to cards like Mox Pearl, Hearth Kami and their later brethren Torch Fiend and Reckless Reveler were inefficient as answers and nowadays, these 3 creatures are hardly seen anymore in Cubes with rares, and even the 720-card averages of rare-restricted Cubes don't play them.
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Basically, these cards were answers to Moxes and other cheap artifacts. Shieldbreaker can actually kill a Mox on turn one without putting it's owner behind on board and while putting it's controller ahead on cards. Getting to be fully mana-efficient during the first two turns of the game using a single card is actually pretty sexy for red decks. While I'm not entirely convinced Embereth Shieldbreaker is a strict upgrade to Manic Vandal, I think power cubes will actually be replacing the vandal with Embereth Shieldbreaker.
 
Velrun

Velrun

(This is a reply to Trainmaster’s logic where he concludes that Power cubes will switch to Embereth Shieldbreaker)
Of course they will. Neither will be in my cube but it is guarenteed that people want efficient tools in a power max environment.

This set makes me want to put in more Knights. Especially the card Ondezeeboot revealed before. The Circle of Loyalty is a bridge between Knights and the Legendary and Historic theme that I am running in Bant. However I do feel like I will be punished going forward if I do this because Knights will likely not be seen very often. It’s probably just a 2019 thing :(
 
psly4mne

psly4mne

Presumably counting down to that twitch thing.

Garruk looks very strong to me, draws an obvious comparison to Elspeth, Sun's Champion.
Not sure about Piper. The Rats might give you enough flexibility on blocking that it can stall the board and steal something, but that might be overly optimistic.
 
Onderzeeboot

Onderzeeboot

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Velrun said:
(This is a reply to Trainmaster’s logic where he concludes that Power cubes will switch to Embereth Shieldbreaker)
Of course they will. Neither will be in my cube but it is guarenteed that people want efficient tools in a power max environment.

This set makes me want to put in more Knights. Especially the card Ondezeeboot revealed before. The Circle of Loyalty is a bridge between Knights and the Legendary and Historic theme that I am running in Bant. However I do feel like I will be punished going forward if I do this because Knights will likely not be seen very often. It’s probably just a 2019 thing :(
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Oh yeah, the Embereth Shieldbreaker easily gets the nod in powered cubes, no question there!

The trailer was just revealed, along with the sets for next year (going back to Theros, a new plane, Core 2021, and going back to post-Eldrazi Zendikar). Ashlen Rose is currently streaming Throne of Eldraine brawl in Arena. The Faerie brawl commander is everything I wanted. Move over Varina, Lich Queen! Welcome Alera, Artful Provocateur!

twTouYvl.png


Tell me that isn't a great bridge between Zur the Enchanter and Sharuum the Hegemon!

There were a lot of cards spoiled: https://www.mtgnexus.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=11118
 
TrainmasterGT

TrainmasterGT

"That Twitch Thing" is the brawl pre-con reveal. There's some kinda interesting stuff in here, but all of the pictures would be super grainy if I tried to give them to you.

There's a Mardu Equipment/Knights and an Esper Enchantress deck.
 
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