General Fight Club
- Thread starter Jason Waddell
- Start date
Man, that's rough. I love both of these cards so much.
In most Cubes, I'd do Sevinne's Reclamation. Being able to cast spells that get incidentally milled is awesome, and the options expand for what you can grab. In core of the CCC though, I'd do Helping Hand. For a core card, it fits that role better. Power level is much closer, the cost is lower, and the effect is simpler.
In most Cubes, I'd do Sevinne's Reclamation. Being able to cast spells that get incidentally milled is awesome, and the options expand for what you can grab. In core of the CCC though, I'd do Helping Hand. For a core card, it fits that role better. Power level is much closer, the cost is lower, and the effect is simpler.
I vote for Reclamation, but both are great.
I love using Reclamation as a poor-man's ramp spell with a fetchland like Prismatic Vista. It's also really fun in Mesmeric Orb decks. It just provides so much utility. It's a simple card that sparks some creativity which is a quality I value highly.
At 660, I'd probably be looking to fit both in to be honest.
I love using Reclamation as a poor-man's ramp spell with a fetchland like Prismatic Vista. It's also really fun in Mesmeric Orb decks. It just provides so much utility. It's a simple card that sparks some creativity which is a quality I value highly.
At 660, I'd probably be looking to fit both in to be honest.
I also wanna vote both. Helping Hand I feel is a pretty clean card, but Reclamation is probably more powerful and has more play to it
I would go:
Both>Sevinne's Reclamation>Helping Hand.
I think if you want this to be a deck the effect redundancy is very important.
Sevinne's Reclamation is a more playable and more interesting card by itself.
Helping Hand is awesome if you have good things to reanimate with it, but it's not as good if it's not a part of a deck's primary plan.
Both>Sevinne's Reclamation>Helping Hand.
I think if you want this to be a deck the effect redundancy is very important.
Sevinne's Reclamation is a more playable and more interesting card by itself.
Helping Hand is awesome if you have good things to reanimate with it, but it's not as good if it's not a part of a deck's primary plan.
Sevinne's Reclamation, no question. It working from the graveyard and hitting all kinds of permanents make it a much more interesting, playable and synergetic card.I'd go with the seacrome coast cycle. Turn 1 and 2 are the most critical turns in most formats.
———
Which white recursion spell would you rather have in the core cube?
Okay, I'll stick with Reclamation for now, but there is another fight up next:
I added Honor to further promote white prowess. It's cool, but now I wonder if Helping Hand could get the same job done (you still have 10-12 creatures) in these decks specifically, while also being more appealing to other strategies.
I added Honor to further promote white prowess. It's cool, but now I wonder if Helping Hand could get the same job done (you still have 10-12 creatures) in these decks specifically, while also being more appealing to other strategies.
Honor's a fantastic card and I love it. I don't think it's close, though. Helping Hand is such a winner. Unearth has probably not been cycled in the last 5 years, and white is a much better color for the effect.
I would go with Helping Hand in your fight. More generically playable and impactful I think, though it's funny that both can rot in hand.
vs
Having a body vs returning more card types (that are all supported in the cube). Thoughts?
vs Having a body vs returning more card types (that are all supported in the cube). Thoughts?
Still Helping Hand. Honor is cool but has fewer practical applications imo.Okay, I'll stick with Reclamation for now, but there is another fight up next:
I added Honor to further promote white prowess. It's cool, but now I wonder if Helping Hand could get the same job done (you still have 10-12 creatures) in these decks specifically, while also being more appealing to other strategies.
Insight is cool if you want to try and make the first ability relevant, but I think Wayfinder is the clear winner otherwise. Also, it is hard to tell what is going on in Dredger's Insight's art, which is a negative in my opinion, even though it's not really a mechanical concern.vs
Having a body vs returning more card types (that are all supported in the cube). Thoughts?
I could definitely see a world where you just play both, usually decks that want these types of cards want multiple copies of the effect. Just one "mill+draw" card is usually not enough for archetype support in my experience.
The body, no question. The life gain isn't going to matter.
Kind of? Between Welder/Engineer/Emry/Scrap Trawler/Myr Retriever/White recursion/Black reanimation there are plenty of ways to recur artifacts.
Similarly, recursive creatures are readily available.
I’m with you on the art! I had planned to include one of these and Hermit Druid as a spicy self-mill option, but could also go safer and just run Satyr and Insight.
The ability to recur more than just lands holds no value to you? Wondering if I am overvaluing that part of the card.
Perhaps you’re slightly undervaluing the body?
You already have Malevolent Rumble for card selection. Green graveyard decks put high value on bodies as there’s already plenty of cards vying for those precious non-creature slots…whether it be reanimation spells or any of a number of tasty enchantments and artifacts
My preference is Wayfinder
Both are fine, but I agree that Wayfinder is more practical and easier to mess around with. It also has the massive benefit of not having an Aetherdrift set symbol, one that pulls me out of the game of Magic more than Spider-Man's face. No card's been in and out of my Cube more than Wayfinder, but that's only because it's such a valuable card at every power level and in almost any context. The same isn't true for Insight, which is good enough reason to prefer Wayfinder. The little Saytr simply communicates more clearly with your drafters what's going on.
But man, Hermit Druid is one of my favorite Magic cards of all time. I would never run either of these over him if you have the choice. It can mill so many cards at once, more than any other card of the style if you draft around it appropriately.
But man, Hermit Druid is one of my favorite Magic cards of all time. I would never run either of these over him if you have the choice. It can mill so many cards at once, more than any other card of the style if you draft around it appropriately.
I have really enjoyed Hermit Druid in my Hidden Depths cube. 3x16 packs gives you a little space to prioritize non-basics in drafts.
Quite possibly, but I think I am mostly overvaluing the leave the GY trigger from Insight. I imagine some non deterministic Trawler loops that gain me a bunch of life or some Gravecrawler nonsense.
I am happy including the Wayfinder, thanks everyone!
mills one less, but also becomes a 2/2 if it whiffs. Ainok Wayfarer is another clone if you don't like it.
or give it a year and we'll have a creature version of Malevolent Rumble
I was looking at sagas today and found the best variant of this card...from a power-level POV at least. It suffers massively from the complexity creep of the era:
Teachings of the Kirin is functionally perfect for my Cube. Such glue! Self-mill, it makes a token on ETB, it's two sacrificeable permanents for 2 mana, it's an enchantment for delirium, it gives counters, and it has incidental gy hate on the back.
But the problems are obvious. It's overly complicated in the biggest way. So much text. So much of it, especially on the back, is wholly unnecessary! It's a lot to grok when passing around packs, and DFCs are already inconvenient.
I also don't like colorless spirit tokens, partially because spirit tokens are still known to have flying and these don't, but in this case, it's even worse since it's both a non-flying spirit and also not white to benefit from crossover of Descendant of Storms.
I think the deeply inelegant design is enough to throw most of you off of this card, but I'm still tempted. It's a great rate for what it is....but maybe I just give Leaves from the Vine a more serious chance.
Teachings of the Kirin is functionally perfect for my Cube. Such glue! Self-mill, it makes a token on ETB, it's two sacrificeable permanents for 2 mana, it's an enchantment for delirium, it gives counters, and it has incidental gy hate on the back.
But the problems are obvious. It's overly complicated in the biggest way. So much text. So much of it, especially on the back, is wholly unnecessary! It's a lot to grok when passing around packs, and DFCs are already inconvenient.
I also don't like colorless spirit tokens, partially because spirit tokens are still known to have flying and these don't, but in this case, it's even worse since it's both a non-flying spirit and also not white to benefit from crossover of Descendant of Storms.
I think the deeply inelegant design is enough to throw most of you off of this card, but I'm still tempted. It's a great rate for what it is....but maybe I just give Leaves from the Vine a more serious chance.