My gut reaction is that Lim-Dul's Vault is pretty nuts. I guess it depends on what cards are there to 'tutor' for, but you basically get to look at 15% of your deck for 1 life... It's an instant, too.
Card/Deck Low Power Card Spotlight
- Thread starter Grillo_Parlante
- Start date
I can't imagine it's "too good" since all it does it set up draws, and at the cost of life and 2 mana with no card draw attached, that's pretty well balanced (especially considering that it's multicolor). I like it a lot and I'd run it if I found the space but it's definitely not gonna be too good unless your format is literally a combo cube.
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
It's an awesome card! Finds you what you need, but doesn't actually put it into your hand. Perfect "tutor"!
Grillo_Parlante
Contributor
Its something of a pet card of mine. Its very skill intensive, as the TOL reorganization effect requires the caster to plan out how they expect the next 5 turns will go, based off of five card "sets" that they see incrementally. In addition, it has all sorts of interesting interactions with self-mill cards, cards that care about TOL, or shuffle effects. There is just a lot of spacial decision making that it requires.
I also like it for the UB tool box control decks that I like to support. Usually, they are looking for a specific answer, and those sort of tutor effects really help them out.
I also like it for the UB tool box control decks that I like to support. Usually, they are looking for a specific answer, and those sort of tutor effects really help them out.
Grillo_Parlante
Contributor
I got to use this for the first time last night, and was really impressed. It seems to manage something that a lot of other enchantments fail to do, offering an effect powerful enough where you want to answer it, but not so powerful that it must be answered immediately. Tortured existence feels very similar, where you can power through it, but you know its going to be an up hill climb.
It has a tremendous amount of play to it, with interesting deck building and play tension, offering a proportionally powerful reward for figuring out the puzzle.
I originally wanted a card like this to reward players for going with higher land counts in a bounceland format. Stormbind asks the player to make a value judgment about which resources should be considered for conversation to damage, as well as managing the rate in which this should happen. Bounced basics make the perfect fuel, but at the same time stormbind functions as a mana sink which could benefit from having more basics in play. Finally, there is a real cost associated with giving up access to certain ETB land triggers, as well as considerations for what could be going to the yard.
It offers inevitably, not unlike goblin bombardment, but at a cost of mana spent, color complexity, and the rate that resources are managed and converted. For example, you could drop it and go all in on stormbind as a strategy in and of it itself, or hold it back to drop it as a surprise source of damage over the course of 1-2 turns, hopefully coordinated with what your ground offensive can generate, to end the game. It can pivot between being a somewhat clunky fireball, board control tool, or steady ping effect, depending on the situation; fitting comfortably in G/R ramp decks, Jund graveyard decks, or G/R beats.
Just really, a surprisingly well designed card.
Convinced me to try out lim-dul's vault! Does seem like a very cool card. Interesting that almost half the time it's a more fairly costed vampiric tutor for 40-card decks, but also sets up 4 more cards after that one. Coolio.
I'm trying to look at potential ways to get some push-through for the "go big" decks. What do we think of this little piece?
I'm trying to look at potential ways to get some push-through for the "go big" decks. What do we think of this little piece?
Grillo_Parlante
Contributor
Convinced me to try out lim-dul's vault! Does seem like a very cool card. Interesting that almost half the time it's a more fairly costed vampiric tutor for 40-card decks, but also sets up 4 more cards after that one. Coolio.
I'm trying to look at potential ways to get some push-through for the "go big" decks. What do we think of this little piece?
Same as the Single Card Spotlight joke, but now it's lower power.
Dom Harvey
Contributor
That's an interesting side benefit to killing their best creature or incidental/ symmetrical mill, in a cube that has toys for leveraging various kinds of mill. I think generally I'd prefer the reliability of self-Unearth effects though.
interesting ramp/tricks options, or just a weak 2/2?
interesting ramp/tricks options, or just a weak 2/2?
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
Yes.
Honestly, I'ld add a second Burning-Tree Emissary to my cube before this, even though Radha reads more interesting.
Chris Taylor
Contributor
vitalize seems very combo-rific, in a elf-ball sort of way.
I was looking through spells that deal 3 damage and happened upon this gem. Actually...... not that bad?
The real cost here is you cant actually cast it if there aren't creatures in play
That... is a bit of a downer. I'm not sure I've ever seen a cube game with zero creatures on the table for an extended period of time. But yeah... bummer.The real cost here is you cant actually cast it if there aren't creatures in play
I guess it also doesn't really hold a candle to it's cousin's either. I mean, Mystic Snake? Absorb? Damn shame, if you ask me.
Chris Taylor
Contributor
Well I mean more to the point is you caaaaaaan cast it if you're winning real hard, but it sucks
"or player". bam!vitalize seems very combo-rific, in a elf-ball sort of way.
I was looking through spells that deal 3 damage and happened upon this gem. Actually...... not that bad?
Alright. FOr real this time. I did some math and everything:
Like the post just a few up where I astonish myself over Ulcerate and Co., this littel beauty hits 164 targets in my cube (tokens included), which ends up being over 86%. Eighty Six Percent. That's almost good enough for Frank Karsten . I guess my big question is, why don't we all run more removal like this? This stuff is virtually unconditional spot removal!
Like the post just a few up where I astonish myself over Ulcerate and Co., this littel beauty hits 164 targets in my cube (tokens included), which ends up being over 86%. Eighty Six Percent. That's almost good enough for Frank Karsten
. I guess my big question is, why don't we all run more removal like this? This stuff is virtually unconditional spot removal!Isn't narcolepsy typically going to be better?
Pacifism type effects suffer in that the creature can be bounced or blinked (both effects typically supported in cube), so it's more conditional than exile effects or straight kill effects.
They aren't bad per se, but blue in particular has so many things you could run a 2CC that slotting in a fairly pedestrian removal spell just feels wrong. Cube power level may dictate otherwise, and there could be interactions with enchantress or whatever too. So it might not be quite that cut and dry, but probably not too far off.
Pacifism type effects suffer in that the creature can be bounced or blinked (both effects typically supported in cube), so it's more conditional than exile effects or straight kill effects.
They aren't bad per se, but blue in particular has so many things you could run a 2CC that slotting in a fairly pedestrian removal spell just feels wrong. Cube power level may dictate otherwise, and there could be interactions with enchantress or whatever too. So it might not be quite that cut and dry, but probably not too far off.
Grillo_Parlante
Contributor
One of the interactions I feature in my cube are the tap-untap interactions, with stuff like galvanic juggernaut, pestermite, quirion ranger etc.
I just never really had room for that type of blue removal, though a certain density of it is, I suppose perfectly functional. I do like it conceptually as conditional removal, but its just going to be hard to find spots for it.
This guy, however, is excellent:
I just never really had room for that type of blue removal, though a certain density of it is, I suppose perfectly functional. I do like it conceptually as conditional removal, but its just going to be hard to find spots for it.
This guy, however, is excellent:
I think he's very playable in most environs! I considered him for myself; that art is pretty sweet, the stats are spicy, and I like the ability, though I do wish it also triggered on mana dorks.. He scales in value based on how many activated abilities are present but at the least of it he's got decent stats.
Grillo_Parlante
Contributor
I would run be ok with running burning-tree, card is sweet. Its one of the cards that made me think WOTC had lost their minds when I returned to magic.
Another RGD card that I remember living in terror of, but which has really fallen off the radar was:
Probably would be an uncommon now.
Another RGD card that I remember living in terror of, but which has really fallen off the radar was:
Probably would be an uncommon now.