Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
Thanks CML, that's well put!
Card/Deck Single Card Spotlight
- Thread starter Dom Harvey
- Start date
I really dig ajani, resource denial strategies are some of my faves and I think they can be fun if you have appropriately efficient plays and spells surrounding it and people know they can be punished for trying to play hay-maker magic or to many value 2/2s for like 3+ mana.
That said I think it's super lame when you can put that deck together constantly (looking at you braidstaxorbwire) and too powerfully. I love it when I can make my venser, mana leak, ajani, tamiyo deck work and I feel like most cubes can handle that if they aren't all about dem durdles.
That said I think it's super lame when you can put that deck together constantly (looking at you braidstaxorbwire) and too powerfully. I love it when I can make my venser, mana leak, ajani, tamiyo deck work and I feel like most cubes can handle that if they aren't all about dem durdles.
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
Funny that you mention those cards. I love Smokestack (and Braids) to death. It's not that I don't like resource denial strategies, but, like CML put it, that Ajani can worsen both color screw and mana screw.
Winter Orb is long gone and is never coming back. Has anyone ever tried Static Orb?
I cut Braids because she was becoming a bit oppressive with reanimation and recursion strategies, though I could see bringing her back in at some point. I'd almost rather add a second Smokestack.
I'm on the fence with Tangle Wire. I enjoy it so I've kept it in, but it has the potential to cross over the "unfun" threshold.
I cut Braids because she was becoming a bit oppressive with reanimation and recursion strategies, though I could see bringing her back in at some point. I'd almost rather add a second Smokestack.
I'm on the fence with Tangle Wire. I enjoy it so I've kept it in, but it has the potential to cross over the "unfun" threshold.
Chris Taylor
Contributor
I dislike Ajani V because My boros decks don't need control cards. He never played as anything other than stagger-helix for me, and the +1 was a damn joke (Also way too many people think it taps things)
Mostly if you weld in another one. Single, proper duration (or +1 with a volt charge or something) tangle wires are fine, but multiples or unlimited duration ones suck
Mostly if you weld in another one. Single, proper duration (or +1 with a volt charge or something) tangle wires are fine, but multiples or unlimited duration ones suck
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
I solved my problem by going the other way around with my cube guilds. Now I don't have to play Boros and I can play Gruul instead. I like Xenagos a lot more than Ajani Vengeant 
Grillo_Parlante
Contributor
Static orb is worse than winter orb i.m.o.
With winter orb you can at least break it with mana dorks/mana rocks and have the game move forward. Static orb is just miserable.
With winter orb you can at least break it with mana dorks/mana rocks and have the game move forward. Static orb is just miserable.
I solved my problem by going the other way around with my cube guilds. Now I don't have to play Boros and I can play Gruul instead. I like Xenagos a lot more than Ajani Vengeant
This is quite a good idea.
Grillo_Parlante
Contributor
Are these guys cubeable? Without breaking singlton in large numbers.
Ezperzoa seems like it just sets you back unless you are playing with a few etherium sculptors. Etherium sculptor is maybe too poisonous? On the other hand, they were good in MMA.
The braids stax part of that was more in response to people I know who's response to black becoming bad was to turn their whole black section into a pox deck that was available every draft with cards no one else wanted. Tanglewire and orb are sorta different issues entirely.
Are these guys cubeable? Without breaking singlton in large numbers.
Ezperzoa seems like it just sets you back unless you are playing with a few etherium sculptors. Etherium sculptor is maybe too poisonous? On the other hand, they were good in MMA.
I would say only if you have a pretty serious critical mass of artifacts. I took a peek at your new cube thread and saw that you were going to try affinity (looking forward to seeing that btw) so they seem most at home there. I've always wanted Esperzoa to be good, and it would be SUCH FUN with lots of etb-trigger artifacts.
I was in that phase just about the time I was exiting mtgsalvation. I can see why people started to do that since black does have some identity issues imo. There are a lot of great black cards to support other colors but I do think it struggles a bit as a central color. I found that Braids was making games kinda unfun since she can be animated/ramped into quickly, recurs easily, and always immediately has a soot counter; Pox is a bit poisonous at BBB and then super poisonous when you consider its effect.
I've been trying to support black devotion instead as a "big black" strategy. The narrowest cards I run in that category are Geralf's Messenger, Phyrexian Obliterator, Gray Merchant of Asphodel, Lashwrithe (new inclusion), and Erebos, God of the Dead (who has been kinda meh). So far I've found that people seem to be able to draft heavy black + another minor support color effectively, which is exactly what I was hoping for.
Edit: thoughts on Mogis's Marauder?
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
Yeah, I went through that phase. Then I started playing the cube with the Pox package, and nobody was ever picking Pox itself, though Smokestack and Braids were well-loved. So, I went and did the only sensible thing, remove Pox.
It's funny you say that Diak old buddy, I was just about to write a post about how cutting white might be the best move for small cubes or people trying to make more consistent multicolour environments. I feel like white's jobs are easily filled by a number of colours and it's one of the least related to popular cross colour themes. 4 mana wraths are a bit of an exception but I think artifacts and custom cards can help ficks that too.
Yeah there's a number of ways to take your black section. I'm sorta surprised Daiky was running pox strat because resource denial must be bruuutal in his more limited feeling cube and like a undying evil'd mulldrifter has got to win the game every time right?
But yeah can you guys hand it to me that as resource denial tricks go, ajani is no braids? I sorta consider them roughly equiv in the "how easily removed" discussion too. If you don't have like shocks and morphs as your baseline speed and efficiency I think you should be okay lol. Like I don't think you guys understand how nice it is for control decks to have multiple lines of play and like ways to make their shitty removal worth more, and like tempo adjusters like tammy and jani are so cross archetype viable and interesting.
Yeah there's a number of ways to take your black section. I'm sorta surprised Daiky was running pox strat because resource denial must be bruuutal in his more limited feeling cube and like a undying evil'd mulldrifter has got to win the game every time right?
But yeah can you guys hand it to me that as resource denial tricks go, ajani is no braids? I sorta consider them roughly equiv in the "how easily removed" discussion too. If you don't have like shocks and morphs as your baseline speed and efficiency I think you should be okay lol. Like I don't think you guys understand how nice it is for control decks to have multiple lines of play and like ways to make their shitty removal worth more, and like tempo adjusters like tammy and jani are so cross archetype viable and interesting.
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
I think Ajani Vengeant is worse than Braids. It tends to screw people over much more by locking them out of a color.
Yeah I really advocate solid and safe mana bases in cube because of the standard means of disrupting big and over reaching decks, but as I've said in older posts it's very common control and value decks are pushed into 3 colours by other drafters who have more liberty with their picks.
It's probably why I take those cards so high in those archetypes. I also tend to make decks (and advocate cubes) with more penned in curves. I'd rather cast more than one 2/3 cost spell consistently than lean on 5/6/7s. I feel like turns are more interesting and my decks are more resistant to disruption that way too.
It's probably why I take those cards so high in those archetypes. I also tend to make decks (and advocate cubes) with more penned in curves. I'd rather cast more than one 2/3 cost spell consistently than lean on 5/6/7s. I feel like turns are more interesting and my decks are more resistant to disruption that way too.
Chris Taylor
Contributor
FSR did a kinda mini-article about his cube design that said 80% of his cards cost 3 or less, pushing people towards the kind of curve you discribe here. I've tried it (Hot damn is it hard with some colors tho) and it seems sweet so far
Thats so cute I'll have to read it. for the record I think 4's are fine they are much more likely to be half a turn than a 5 and feel like a really necessary cost and are usually doing things that feel worth a full turn (master of the hunt, wrath) but like your fives and sixes should feel as good as casting multiple spells on your turn and I'm not just talking about more than one idiot dork. Filling your cube with 2/2s for CC mana in order to enable samey aggro decks doesn't really cut it. Like thragtusk is still a great card in a cube like this and moorland haunt is like so nice!
Chris Taylor
Contributor
I think his point was more to make sure everyone had stuff to do at early turns/encourage eking out small advantages rather than slamming grave titan and laughing.
Green was the notable exception to this rule, and he also has 0 accelleration outside of green IIRC.
Then again, I might be misremembering this
Chris Taylor
Contributor
I never got smallpox to work.
Other 2 are great though
Other 2 are great though
Dom Harvey
Contributor
what Vengevine said
