General The Constructed thread
- Thread starter Dom Harvey
- Start date
Laz
Developer
Singleton main-deck Erase has been something I have been doing a lot lately. It is very rarely a completely dead card.
Plus, you know, Banishing Light and Utter End...
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
Esper nonsense
| Creatures (4) 3 Nyx-fleece Ram 1 Resolute Archangel Planeswalkers (6) 4 Ashiok, nightmare weaver 2 Elspeth, Sun's Champion Sorceries (12) 4 Thoughtseize 3 Divination 3 End Hostilities 2 Drown in Sorrow Instants (12) 4 Hero's Downfall 2 Utter End 2 Dig through time 2 Dissolve 2 Disdainful Stroke | Sideboard (15) 2 Dissolve 2 Negate 1 End Hostilities 2 Jace's Ingenuity 1 Drown in Sorrow 3 Last Breath 1 Resolute Archangel 1 Liliana Vess 1 Deicide 1 ?????? |
Don't remember the land base off the top of my head, but it's a pretty fair mixture- color screw is still the #1 reason this deck mulligans or loses. Note having double black or white the clutch turn to keep on par with your opponent is often gg.
Game plan is to 1:1 major threats and resolve / protect walkers while drawing cards, which no other deck actually does. Nightmare match for midrange decks, who are heavily pressured by ashiok, it has to make enough concessions to aggro to take a game 1 from them. Decks it has the most trouble with are heavier-control decks (two players run a 16-counterspell counterburn deck here, not sure this deck can beat it.) and its own mana.
Have tried many versions with different numbers- a version with more digs / another with ingenuities main clogged my hand with uncastable spells too often. Bile blight isn't good enough against weenie decks as a 1:1 where drown in sorrow is a wrath.
The sorcery speed of banishing light makes it very awkward when you'd like to pass completely untapped- hence utter end. Trading two dissolves for two disdainful strokes is just easier on the mana and lets you keep up with caryatid->4-drop when you're on the draw.
This is hardly fine-tuned, a friend of mine just chunked together a version every week for a few weeks, I played a 5-round FNM with and reported back. This was the most successful by far.
Laz
Developer
Looks fun. I might give it a whirl some time soon.
Edit: Wow... just tried building this. The mana-base is a special kind of terrible.
First cut (which is really short on white, by like 4-5 sources):
1 Caves of Koilos
2 Dismal Backwater
2 Evolving Wilds
1 Flooded Strand
3 Polluted Delta
4 Temple of Deceit
3 Temple of Enlightenment
3 Temple of Silence
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
3 Island
2 Swamp
1 Plains
Edit: Wow... just tried building this. The mana-base is a special kind of terrible.
First cut (which is really short on white, by like 4-5 sources):
1 Caves of Koilos
2 Dismal Backwater
2 Evolving Wilds
1 Flooded Strand
3 Polluted Delta
4 Temple of Deceit
3 Temple of Enlightenment
3 Temple of Silence
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
3 Island
2 Swamp
1 Plains
I also have an Esper list I've been tweaking as well over the last two weeks. I'm kinda eh on the mana base right now, might want to make room for another Urborg and throw in another Strand. I'm currently at:
Esper Control
| Planeswalkers (3) 3 Elspeth, Sun's Champion Sorceries (9) 3 Divination 4 End Hostilities 2 Despise Instants (13) 2 Last Breath 1 Utter End 2 Dig through time 4 Dissolve 2 Disdainful Stroke 2 Jace's Ingenuity Enchantments (8) 4 Singing Bell Strike 4 Banishing Light | Lands (27) 2 Flooded Strand 2 Polluted Delta 3 Temple of Silence 4 Temple of Deceit 4 Temple of Enlightenment 1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth 2 Swamp 4 Plains 5 Island | Sideboard (15) 2 Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver 1 Resolute Archangel 1 Prognostic Sphinx 1 Erebos, God of the Dead 2 Negate 1 Dig Through Time 2 Thoughtseize 1 Utter End 1 Last Breath 2 Disdainful Stroke 1 Fated Retribution |
I've only gotten the chance to play FNM once with the list before tweaking it to it's current state (sideboard wasn't nearly as effective before), and it performed pretty solidly. Singing Bell Strike wrecks people so badly. It's just scary in G1 if your Elspeth's are dealt with easily/Thoughtseized away. There's like no other way to win in G1. Out of the sideboard Ashiok just wrecks people and Prognasty has been super sweet.
Hey kittens, I know this doesn't block but does it die to anything MD and do you think it's easy enough to protect for black control decks in standard
Isn't this kind of like Nephalia Drownyard but costs a card and is terrible?
What gives you the most trouble? Having to tap low/out for your sorcery removal then losing to haste / stormbreath activations?
I've never lost to a singing bell strike in limited so I just kind of assumed the card was bad, but plenty of decks don't want to make it to six mana, and if they pass to leave up untap mana while you have removal they're essentially timewalked. Without trying it I still feel it's not great to let someone untap their idiot a couple turns later while you have counterspells in-hand. I see how your build works but I couldn't run it in my meta- people are so in love with hydras I'm getting maindeck mistuctter'd over here.
I've actually had a pretty good game against Stormbreath decks, not much trouble unless I'm left holding lands and crappy spells late game which happens every now and then. The biggest issue is getting to the late game, but that's where the Singing Bell Strike comes in and helps us get there. Sometimes I find myself running low on cards if I can't hit my card draw or Digs to refuel. I'm basically looking to deal with threats one-for-one until I can wipe the board then follow up with an Elspeth late game. Most of the time, whichever creature gets tapped down is just out for the rest of the game, essentially two mana pseudo-removal. I like how the Strikes let me hold off threats till I hit an End Hostilities to wipe the board, then it helps to fuel my Digs to reach an Elspeth. But yeah, in a meta with Mistcutters main, Strikes won't be useful at all.
The biggest issue I've had is dealing with a deck like Mardu Walkers just chock full of threat after threat. I got randomly smashed by a Zurgo Helmsmasher out of the sideboard in one match. It was Zurgo, hit for 7, I Banishing Light Zurgo, Utter End the Banishing Light, smash for 7 more. It was disgusting.
Dom Harvey
Contributor
send help
Zuran
| | | |
How are you fixing for that deck?
Dom Harvey
Contributor
Prob just a normal GBW manabase with a Breeding Pool and a Watery Grave and no Treetop Villages/Tec Edges
Okay, because you have a UU spell in there, and like 6 other blue spells and a red splash card. Didn't know if you needed more 5-color lands.
Dom Harvey
Contributor
It's certainly possible - Gemstone Mine is probably fine here - but fetchlands do a lot here as you can imagine.
Yeah, I mean, I played Tribal Flames aggro in Modern, a similar base probably does work here, especially with 4x Bop (or in my case, 4x Deathrite, r.i.p.)
Thought experiment: if you could build a Vintage deck with any number of Treasure Cruises, abstractly what number would you settle on?
Onderzeeboot
Ecstatic Orb
Obviously the Threads can also be cast "for free" with one of the Zurs, so it's not really a UU spell most of the time. Also, you have eight one-drops that help with generating blue mana.